(Short update: Lots of things, including one big thing, came out in the inspection, so I am no longer buying a house. But I did buy a car yesterday, the first car I've ever personally owned. So things are not as I expected but just fine. Assuming I pass all my exams for school. But anyway.)
Everyone's either in week 2 of school or about to start school or starting school in three weeks, so I thought today would be a good time for a school-related Primal Scream Wednesday. Possible topics include: difficulty of finding and cost of school supplies, bad room assignments, screwed up bus routes, our own fears, social anxiety (our kids' and our own), and exactly how involved we want to be with the PTA.
Of course, non-school-related primal screams are also welcome.
I currently have none, as last week was one long scream. So you start.
@Jen, please feel free to email me about your cousin's situation. I'm so sorry she is going through this. I really understand, as longtime Moxie readers will remember.
I'm happy to report though, that as of last Monday, I have "sole and exclusive physical and legal custody" of my daughter, and the abusive ex is forbidden to have "any contact whatsoever" with me or my daughter. I feel really lucky, and I know many victims of domestic violence are not so fortunate, but maybe you and your cousin can take some hope from my story.
So, no primal scream from me this time (woohoo!), and much support and love to all of you with struggles large and small.
Posted by: Maria | August 17, 2011 at 11:30 PM
Oops, sorry Jen, my email is maria (at) davidgrover (dot) com. Please really do use it.
Posted by: Maria | August 17, 2011 at 11:31 PM
Yay for Maria!
Posted by: paola | August 18, 2011 at 02:25 AM
Ditto on the Yay for Maria! Wow, that's been a long time coming, and I'm so glad you have that in place now.
Also Ditto on the compassion for Anon... the thing that I think is unrecognized (often) in the discussion is that part of the decision is between two 'bad'/challenging situations, but the other part is between two good things. It is the good side of the choices that sometimes are harder to balance, because we're taught so hard to not be selfish. Choosing a good (baby could be an unexpected joy) vs. a good (life as it stands is good) and where neither are guaranteed? Tricky to balance that. So, additional sympathy for having to choose between two complex situations where the outcomes are uncertain, and have both positive and negative aspects on each side.
If the talking with God thing doesn't work for you, you might also try just talking to the baby (though likely you have already). Having had very strong 'soul to soul' connections with my kids pre-conception and pre-birth, my belief is very strongly that this is a TWO WAY contract. You can ask them to find another way here. I've also talked with many other women who have had that soul conversation, where they were feeling pressured to let a child in, and where some of them made a choice not to say yes (even pre-conception), and instead said 'another lifetime, or find your way to me in this life in another way'.
My own childhood memories include remembering before I was conceived, where there were many of us 'in line' for my mom (she ended up having seven kids, the first six unplanned, the seventh with my step-dad who was infertile...). I remember us all kind of jockeying for position, knowing the further down the line we were, the less odds of getting in. There were those who didn't make it in. And... now there are people who have joined our family (younger than my youngest brother) who are completely at home in our family. We call them friblings (friend/siblings), and there is universal feeling that they just found their way to us, having come in by another route. I know adoptive parents feel the same way - that their child was unable to join them the 'typical' way, so found another way. Other ways are good.
My own experiences also include six miscarriages, one of which came with very strong sense that the child was not mine (even well before any signs of anything wrong). I suspect I'll encounter that soul again. (G, the eldest, told me when she was later born to another mother. He was 3 at the time.)
Elisabeth Hallett wrote a few books on pre-birth communication (experiences like mine), and through multiple conversations came to the same general conclusion - that you can decline the offer of being the route through which the soul comes here. You might be their first choice, or you might not even be the first option for them, but you're not their last option. There are other ways in, good ways included. She has a website with some stories on it, which may or may not be useful to you (www.light-hearts.com)
I don't know if that helps. Hopefully it doesn't make anything more challenging. Best to you, and like others said, be gentle with yourself.
I have no primal screams other than the house not being ready for school to start. And that's more like a primal meh.
Posted by: hedra | August 18, 2011 at 06:27 AM
I feel a bit reluctant to add my minor primal scream after some of the heartwrenching previous posts. My heart goes out to all of you dealing with loss of whatever kind. There were times last year when the world was so full of sorrow (only tangentially connected to me) it seemed unbearable.
My school related scream is this - we're starting preschool this year, and I don't have much anxiety about that process. What I don't understand and is making me CRAZY is this: What do you do with your kids after school and on holidays if you work full time? Daycare is awesome! Because it lasts until 5 or 6! I cannot leave work at 3 to pick up my kids every day, and I'm having trouble finding someone to do it for me. There must be services that exist, but I don't know anything about them. Advice from working parents out there? (The preschool has aftercare, but the toddler isn't eligible. I guess they figure everyone in the toddler classroom is a SAHM.)
Posted by: Erin | August 18, 2011 at 08:53 AM
another *huge* 'YAY!' for maria & her dd!! i'm so so glad he kept showing his ass enough that even the legal system caught on.
no screams here except i quit my job this week. mainly for logistical reasons - my son starts pre-k in the autistic classroom 30 min away next week, which means driving him to & from every day at hours that aren't compatible with traditional nursing shifts - but also because they expected 10 hours of work to be done in an 8 hr shift & i couldn't deliver. i'll find something...
i'm mainly excited about pre-k, though. i really hope he learns some skills & gains some tools.
peace to all of y'all/us struggling, though. and new digs vibes for moxie, lod, el c & el p.
Posted by: marci | August 18, 2011 at 09:25 AM
Erin: We stayed in daycare vs enrolling in a traditional preschool. DH and I both work fulltime and we could not find the solution. Frustrating! We also picked our daycare because their van will pick up at our kids eventual elementary school so there is after school care. Again- can't leave work at 3!
Daycare provides social interaction and they do have lessons- colors, numbers, letters, etc. so we are gambling that it will be enough in addition to what we do at home.
Posted by: Amy | August 18, 2011 at 10:17 AM
@Erin - We did the same as @Amy with our son. Our daycare has the same setup for elementary school - with the buses picking up and dropping off at the center, if needed.
Our daycare is in the same town that we live in (so same public schools) which helps of course, as other town's school districts won't bus kids out of their town.
I can't say enough good things about our daycare. It is a corporate center, yes, but they are NAEYC accredited and they have, from what I have been told, a very good play based preschool curriculum. My son has thrived there. I will admit that I never did compare it to more traditional preschools because we both work full time and daycare was the only option that would work for us, so I don't know what we are "missing." But I'm so not worried about it.
Posted by: Stacy | August 18, 2011 at 10:27 AM
@Amy & Stacy - yes and the frustrating thing for us is that we signed a preschool contract & paid a deposit and THEN got a miraculous spot at the university daycare, where we had been on a waitlist for 3 years. But we can't back out of the preschool contract (at least not without significant financial loss) and don't know if the kids will have spots next year. So we're kind of stuck. Grrrr. . . . I guess I didn't think hard enough about how the preschool logistically wouldn't work for us.
Posted by: Erin | August 18, 2011 at 10:34 AM
Good luck @Erin! One of the most frustrating things about being a working mom is how it seems like the world of kids is not set up for the traditional 9-5 (plus commute time, so 8ish-6ish)work schedule!
Posted by: Stacy | August 18, 2011 at 10:41 AM
I'm 37 weeks pregnant. Healthy pregnancy, but scared out of mind for labor/delivery/recovery. I have a pre-baby to-do list both at home and at work, both a mile long. I've had an increase in contractions from about 3-7 PM each day. I need rest more so the contractions subside, but I can't figure out where to cut back on my to-do lists. I'm so fatigued I'm making ridiculous and time-consuming mistakes, which is just adding things to the pile. And I have clearly lost a healthy perspective and a sunny outlook!
Posted by: Kara | August 18, 2011 at 10:47 AM
My primal scream: The back to school stuff is no sweat really. Even I'm going back for 2 classes A&P 2, and Chem 2, and I'm good. Oldest is 6 and going to 1st grade, very excited and just ready. School supplies done early and we're dropping off at the Meet the Teacher night, and school no issue.
The issue is my 2 year old I took in for her 2 year old pediatrician check-up and the doc told me that he wants her to be checked out by a pediatric cardiologist for a murmur, in my head I know that a murmur can be no big deal, but I'm worried. Through some friends we were able to wangle out an appointment on Monday Aug 22, and hopefully we'll know more then. I'm glad we have such supportive and helpful friends, but I'm so scared to death that there is something wrong and the health of my kids is just something I will always get worked up about.
Oh and I'm about 17 weeks pregnant, and some days I'm not sure what the hell we were thinking, but other days I can't wait to meet this little one.
SoAnonforthis: I've been in the same headspace where you are. I wish you peace.
Posted by: Shalini | August 18, 2011 at 11:29 AM
@Maria - HOORAY!!! Your news totally made my day! ;)
@Moxie - I'm sorry the house was not as advertised, though what a blessing in disguise that big finding during the inspection was! Best of luck on your exams.
@Paola - I'm sorry your marathon plans had to be put on hold, and I wish you a quick recovery.
@Anons going though pregnancy-related upheavals - Hugs to all of you, and ditto to all of the sage advice here. I'm glad this is a space where you can find the nonjudgmental support you deserve.
@Working parents trying to figure out school logistics in a world that is soooo not at all structured to support a working family's schedule - It sucks. I wish you flexible solutions, trained monkey assistants, and some serious understanding from employers and coworkers as you attempt to find what works for you and yours.
Posted by: hush | August 18, 2011 at 11:34 AM
@Maria - hooray!
@soAnon...I'm glad it helped. I got email about that piece and really, really: You are not alone. I am certain whatever you decide you will run with and be ok. I was thinking last night how ironic it is that a lot of people would...well, not praise, but be at greater peace with a teen for knowing what she could not handle, but not be equally at peace with a 40+ year old with life experience about the same belief/knowledge.
Posted by: Shandra | August 18, 2011 at 11:41 AM
@Maria - I am so very happy for you both!!! Wonderful news!
@SoAnonforthis and everyone sharing their stories, thank you for the honesty and compassion you are showing with each other. Pregnancy in any form doesn't touch on my situation currently but they are things I've thought about since turning 35.
@the milliner - sending positive thoughts your way!
@sadfreind - those things are unspeakably horrible. I was, before reading your post, worried about the upcoming school year and finances and other little things...that seemed big until I realized that as of right now, the boy and I will get to have this upcoming school year. I am incredibly thankful for that.
Posted by: mom2boy | August 18, 2011 at 11:45 AM
Like others, my primal scream seems petty compared to other posts, but my need to scream is pretty big, so here goes. My 15-month daughter was just getting over Coxackie virus when my husband came down with it. Bad. Bedridden for days. I work part-time, but have a months-in-the-making huge deadline next week, and am stressed about health of baby, health of husband, making it through the day, and making deadlines. I'm up with her at 5, and by 8am I need a nap or I start throwing up from stress and exhaustion. And, underneath it all, a dread that I'll get sick next - and then what? How do you take care of a toddler while lying in bed with a fever? I feel like there is just no room for error right now, and what's adds to it is that my situation isn't even that bad - how will I manage it when things are really complicated?? All I want to do is catch up on sleep and have someone else take care of everything for a day.
Posted by: Dory | August 18, 2011 at 01:28 PM
I am loving this post! Best wishes to everyone...My primal scream is: The cost of full time day care is insane!!! I am a single mom to my four year old daughter. I work full time, so she is in day care full time. I love her school, but that monthly tuition is killing me. I make too much money to get any assistance, and don't make enough so that it's not a struggle. Every.month...I am so grateful that I just have one more year of it.
Posted by: Ana | August 18, 2011 at 02:18 PM
Sorry about the house Moxie. I have a different kind of primal scream - dealing with the frustration of not enough time as I'm trying to launch an online reading and math program for kids.
Posted by: Asa | August 18, 2011 at 02:21 PM
@dory, don't underestimate the impact of sleep deprivation on your ability to function normally and feel sane. There is a reason it is used as a form of torture.
(Which is just to say- go easy on yourself. You're allowed to think things suck right now.)
@Erin- do you have something like College Nannies and Tutors in your town? I ask because you mentioned a university day care. They are in the back of my mind as a potential solution once we move from day care to school, if the after school care doesn't work out.
I don't really have a primal scream, just a whine. Our day care, which we really like, has lost a bunch of kids to a newer center recently, and I'm a bit worried that they might go under, forcing me to find a new place. Which would suck. But like I said, that's a whine not a scream. And I keep telling myself "don't borrow trouble" because they're still there now, and probably things will pick up for them before the situation gets critical.
Posted by: Cloud | August 18, 2011 at 03:56 PM
@Maria, Yay, yay, yay! Great news.
@Paola, Not fun...especially after you've worked so hard. Hope you heal well and quickly.
@mom2boy, Thanks! I'll take 'em!
@Shandra, Very astute point and ITA: "...how ironic it is that a lot of people would...well, not praise, but be at greater peace with a teen for knowing what she could not handle, but not be equally at peace with a 40+ year old with life experience about the same belief/knowledge."
Posted by: the milliner | August 18, 2011 at 09:04 PM
Maria!!!! congrats! Thrilled for you and your daughter! What a wonderful relief! FREEDOM!!
and .. hi, Hedra! miss you!
Posted by: mrsHaley | August 18, 2011 at 10:17 PM
@Maria, congrats! what fabulous news!!
@Paola, sorry to hear about your injury. Healing thoughts to you.
Posted by: Lisa F. | August 19, 2011 at 08:02 AM
@Cloud - I'm working on the college babysitter angle. I have lots of experience with college-aged sitters and they can be great, but it's also a hassle. They have complicated schedules and can almost never do 4-5 days a week, so you usually have to get more than one, etc etc. It's a lot of work to set up and manage, IME. But that's my next step.
Someone recently said to me when you get your kids out of daycare and into school you realize so clearly 1) how many SAHMs there are (whereas in daycare everyone you know works); and 2) how much life is structured for there to be a SAHP. But it's also true that my town has a standard after-school care program in all its elementary schools. Of course, if I weren't a part-time single parent this wouldn't be so fraught.
Posted by: Erin | August 19, 2011 at 08:25 AM
Maria! I am too so very, very happy to read your news. Wonderful!
Paola hope your knee is getting better and that you've found a good physio.
the milliner, I really hope your DH will find there's nothing wrong in those tests. He doesn't need another thing.....Good thoughts.
And Moxie, sorry about the house but honestly, it's so much better to find out before you've bought. Ask me how I know. Not. It's boring.
Not even a whimper here, and feeling so, so lucky and blessed to be able to write that. DD is looking forward to returning to pre-school and it looks very much like she will be able to attend in underpants and not pull-ups. Not saying anything but it looks like our latest attempt on the potty issue is succeeding.
I do agree her pre-school too seems to assume we're all SAHP. I am as it happens, but just about the only one. Everyone else has this juggling act to do.
On the anon pregnancy thing I should go anonymous probably. And this may not help.
There is a weird thing in my maternal line of women having babies at 41 or so. For generations. My mother had secondary infertility for 15 years before I appeared.
Mother did not want me, but didn't want to terminate as her school friend had died of the consequences of a back street abortion.
She was married, and quite well off and her fears were dismissed. The obstetrician said she'd love the baby once it was there and prescribed domestic help.
She did up to a point. Love the baby. But the pregnancy worsened her mental issues and as a mother myself now I can see what she complained about with me. Except I can see that DD is a normal young child- constant need. Mother thought I was bad. Not her choice to think that probably. The rest of the family and friends half thought I was a blessing and the other half that I was a millstone around the neck.
My mother didn't use the right contraception as she thought she didn't need it. If she had used it it could have failed. It can happen to any woman. Not the mental issues, the pregnancy.
I was supposedly unable to conceive got pregnancy at nearly 42 and had DD.
And it's been a miracle, and still is. Light of my life. But it is very hard work too. And make no mistake I'll be a pensioner when DD graduates from university ( if she chooses too). Having a baby at any time is huge, in mid-life it's got different aspects. So does having a baby in your teens.
As others have said better, everyone sees the teenager's hardship but not the forty-something's.
I got pregnant again when DD stopped breastfeeding abruptly. I was tired, she was not sleeping, I've no family support. I really was not physically able. Sick as dog again. Then still being sick I miscarried.
Which was a grief, a big one, but also in practice a relief. I couldn't then cope with two. I would have coped, but it would have been very hard.
There is I think no painless solution to pregnancy. Whether you go on to have the baby, whether you go on to terminate or whether nature terminates it for you. It all comes with pain and grief.
But there is the best solution for you, and only you can know what that is. And making the right decision will lead to the best outcome. And be right for mother and baby and the rest of the family.
I'm glad to be here, but I'm glad I've got the choice my mother didn't have too. And glad I didn't have to choose. My heart goes out to those struggling with that.
Posted by: Wilhelmina | August 19, 2011 at 08:35 AM
@Erin - I had the same thought from a SAHM perspective. After putting myself out there since ds was about 18 months (he's 3) to try to find the right mom-friend chemistry - someone I click well with that has a child that ds clicks with as well (and if they have a hubby that mine likes too - well, that almost seems too much to ask for). I've put myself out there over and over again with only mediocre results. It's a small town and I thought I'd pretty much run through all the kids ds's age. Then I remembered all the kids in daycare that we'll get to meet in 2 years when kindergarten starts. Right now the working moms are existing in a parallel universe.
My primal meh (love that!) is that every single 3 year old in this town is headed for pre-k in a few weeks- except my son. He could really really use the socialization. There just isn't the money. Any low-income answers require us to enroll him all day 5 days a week, which seems worse to me than not doing it at all. And he absolutely refuses to poop in the potty.
I know it isn't the end of the world for a 3 year old to be home with mommy, but it is flaming my insecurities about our abilities to provide well for our son.
@Maria - Wahoo!!
Posted by: Elaine | August 19, 2011 at 09:43 AM
My best wishes to all of you. There are some kind people with good advice here.
My primal scream is for a good thing - mr. flea got an excellent job, 6 days before his old job (post-doc) ended and we were getting on the unemployment train. But it was sudden, and it's 400 miles away, and it happened too late to avoid moving the kids mid-school year, so we are prepping to sell the house, move, find a new place, find the right school in the new city, leave our (lovely) community and school, leave my job at a very busy time of the year, etc. All happening in the next 6 weeks. I am literally up 2 hours every night from 2-4am worrying.
It's a good thing, and we will all be fine, but I have a lot of grief (and guilt) over the losses, especially my nearly 8 year old's friends and teachers. She said to me, "I'm going to have to make all new friends," and what could I say but, "Yes, you are." Her (beloved) art teacher wrote an email that made me cry at work.
Posted by: flea | August 19, 2011 at 09:48 AM
Yay for Maria!!
Moxie, I’m sorry the house didn’t work out, but there will be another one and it will be just as awesome, or even better!
And to SoAnonymousForThis, be gentle on yourself. Sometimes the right decision is the hardest one to make.
My primal scream is less of a scream and more of a whimper. I moved to a new school district shortly before school started (it starts in the beginning of August for us), but due to the fact that my son was going to get the same fantastic teacher he had for his Kinder year, I fought to keep him in the school he was in. That all worked out (eventually, and not without a couple of meltdowns--mine, of course), but his teacher emailed me last week to let me know that academically my son is doing great, but that he seems withdrawn, not as eager, and not himself. Since his dad and I are getting a divorce, I wasn’t surprised, but it just made me sad. I know time will help heal, but I wish I could speed the process up for him! I hate that the thing I HAD to do (for all of us, but especially for me) is the thing that is making him sad and withdrawn. I wish I could go back to his dad, if it would really make it better for him, but I just can not do that, and I know that while this is hard, it would not help in the long run if I went back.
Posted by: Mogget | August 19, 2011 at 10:43 AM
Oh, @flea, I'm so happy for you and sorry for you at the same time. That is hard. Science is a bitch sometimes. I hope you come to love the new place!
Posted by: Cloud | August 19, 2011 at 10:44 AM
@Elaine - Low-cost options for pre-school aged kids: the library and the park district. Our library has free programs 1-2 times per week (and more if you hit all the library branches in the area) of play and story time. Great for socialization.
Our park district programs require you to pay for them but are usually very reasonable (average about $8 per session, usually you do for 6 weeks or a month, etc). We have sports, art, drama, etc.
Posted by: SarcastiCarrie | August 19, 2011 at 03:56 PM
I just had to come back here one more time to tell all you amazing people what a huge difference it made to me on Wednesday to feel the caring that came through your comments to me. I will never, ever forget it. I know it's been said over and over, but what a special place this is. I'm grateful to have found it.
Posted by: SoAnonymousForThis | August 19, 2011 at 05:26 PM
Thank you all so much for your Yays! The Moxie Community has been a source of great strength and wisdom for me through this whole awful process, as well as for regular ol' parenting and life stuff. Also, I 'met' a good friend through these comments, whose help has been *invaluable* throughout.
Posted by: Maria | August 20, 2011 at 12:14 AM
What a beautiful, supportive community this is. I feel blessed to have found it- I come here when I need perspective and a place that is free of judgment.
Posted by: Shoshana | August 20, 2011 at 03:53 PM
Just wanted to say thank you to Nico and Hedra who have reminded me that there are other options about baby number 4 rather than just bumping heads with my husband about it. Today I am feeling that another baby would be great, so my feelings are really flowing in different directions, changing with how tired I feel.
Nice to see you back here Hedra, and also YAY for Maria!
Posted by: Sky | August 20, 2011 at 04:52 PM
Thanks everyone for your kind words. Knee is ok apparently, just old condition 'exacerbated' due to new terriain (lots of hills as @wilhelmina can attest to). Should still be able to make it for mid Sept.
Posted by: paola | August 21, 2011 at 06:27 AM
This is small potatoes indeed compared to what some are facing, but my job is reaching a whole new level of non-profit chaos and I'm not sure we're going to make it. And I'm not sure how well I'm going to be able to handle that, having invested an awful lot of myself in it.
That said, I have an awesome husband and daughter, and so much of what really matters in my life is great. And, he's a tenured prof, and we could make it on his salary if needed (and we sure wouldn't be losing health insurance, etc.)
Still. AAAAAAAGH!
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Posted by: Deledruro | February 06, 2013 at 07:37 PM
Tutaj zadnej gadce stanowic nie moze – kredyt gotowkowy jest tansza kondycja wierzytelnosci, zas roznosc w oplaty istnieje jawnie solidna.
Najwazniejszego frazeologizmy w celu kredytu w euro przypadly na leci 2009-2011, podczas gdy okrojono admitancja az do kredytow we frankach.
O wiele dogorywajze wypadek ma sie sposrod obcymi panszczyznami, ktorych zadaja pozyczkodawcy, tudziez o jakich banalny czlowiek nie ma zrozumienia.
Na nieszczescie, ma niewiasta swoja danine, a branie chwilowki w krajowych wymogach wybitnie naprowadza chodzenie po polu minowym –
Nie fatyguje to tym ubieglym rok w rok dostawac sie co chwila owo lepszych rezultatow, jako ze wierzytelnosci pozabankowe, obok, ze urzedowo nielubiane, maja coraz wiecej entuzjastow.
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Posted by: NeefBlise | February 07, 2013 at 03:21 PM
SPOsRoD RRSO nastepuje kawa na lawe ogolny cena pozyczki, jaki oraz winien podarowac polska obserwacje.
Bylo zeby to niebezkonfliktowe sposrod zasadniczymi zarzadzeniami gospodarki, poniewaz jesli popyt rosnie to danina musi niemniej jednak znajdowac sie interesujaca.
Smakowitym miejscem na poszukiwania istnieje net, znajdziemy w owa strone przerazliwa kwote ofert, na dokladna materie kazdy dogoni malenko w zamyslu sobie.
Dlatego ze mimo to nie mozna zadluzac sie w bezgranicznosc.
NATOMIAST nie spaceruje tu o ciz oprocentowanie, jakiego wielkosc poprawia (na eudajmonia) trzezwa rozporzadzenie.
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Posted by: Deledruro | February 07, 2013 at 03:21 PM
Suma niezbicie podlega od momentu specjalnosci, od czasu owego, czym informacja figura sie pochlania, jakich celow, sprzetow, planow zas alternatywy postuluje.
Pozbycie sie swoich kredytow nie jest latwa trescia, co nie obejmuje niemniej, ze nie mozna biezacego osiagnac.
Chwilowki, natomiast tedy smiglego pozyczki, jakie dostac mozemy w niejakiej z setek jednostek pozyczkowych, rozsianych po terenie calkowitej Jezyk polski, to rozumie sie samo przez sie najwygodniejsza tudziez najszybsza gatunek wydzierzawienia pieniedzy.
Jednostce pozyczkowe niezwykle z zapalem nasuwaja nam bowiem o tym, iz spoznilismy sie ze splata raty – brzecza, deleguja listy wzglednie przysylaja az do nas swojego pracownika.
Wlozmy, ze podejmujemy pozyczka (wzglednie pozyczke) na sume 10 000 zlocistych, oprocentowana na poziomie 10% w rangi roku.
chwilówka
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Posted by: NeefBlise | February 08, 2013 at 12:27 PM
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Posted by: aoijrtncaw | February 12, 2013 at 05:03 AM