Siblings (not) going to sleep in the same room

Happy Australia Day!

This is a problem I'm having, and I'm betting someone else is having similar problems, and I know some of you will have good suggestions:

I'm in a two-bedroom apartment, so my boys (who are almost-8 and 4.5) share a bedroom. This is fine, except that they have a veeery hard time falling asleep in the same room. They laugh together, or they fight, or they just talk and talk and talk. I sometimes come in every five minutes to tell them to be quiet, and it doesn't help. If I lie down with one of them they'll stop talking, but then I wake up in a puddle of my own drool at midnight. (It's just like having a 2-year-old again!)

If I let one of them fall asleep in my bed, it starts a major fight. If I let them both fall asleep in my bed, they don't fall asleep.

I am sure that part of the problem is the late schedule: By the time I get home from work and pick them up from their dad's and walk home and make dinner and they eat it, it's 8 o'clock. So they have half an hour before they have to put on PJs and brush their teeth and go to bed. But then they don't actually fall asleep until 9:15 or 9:30 or even 10:00 some nights because they just can't seem to settle down and stop interacting.

I know this isn't enough sleep for them, and that mornings would be better for everyone if they were getting more sleep. But I can't put them in separate rooms to fall asleep. Any ideas?

Comments

[enu]

I sent 'em off to different colleges. Problem solved....

[Rosemary]

@Paola!!!!

How could you forget the stinking hot Australia Day trip to the beach???? Time to come home for a reminder!!

My 4 year old is dying to have the 4 month old in his room. He keeps dragging the bassinet in there and I have to keep fishing it out again. Maybe I should just give it a try.

[Cloud]

@Moxie- you've got a lot of good suggestions here. I have nothing to add on that, but I will say that maybe you need to sit down and figure out what the problem(s) really is (are) and also try to deconvolute the problems from the guilt you're probably carrying around about how they have to fit their routines into the arrangements you've made post-divorce, and just more generally as a working mom. So many times, I've been banging my head against a wall trying to solve a parenting problem, when the solution is right there, but I don't want to see it because it makes my mommy guilt go haywire.

Try to remember that kids have been fitting into adult schedules for ever and ever, and that the need to do this isn't unique to being a working mom, or a divorced mom, or anything else. It is just how things are.

Easier said than done, I know.

[AmyinTexas]

Have not read comments so I apologize if this has been said.

Data points: My two older children (almost 10 and 7.5) shared a room until last November and each night was just as you've described it. Even if they weren't talking, if one had on the reading lamp they both did, etc. We finally made the downstairs playroom into a make-shift bedroom for the oldest while we look for a new house with more space. It has made a HUGE difference in the morning routine *and* while the middle child complained about not wanting to sleep by herself when we moved her older brother... once we actually moved him, she did not complain one iota about going to bed alone. They both fall asleep in record time, and I'm left wondering what took us so long to separate them.

You said that one is angry if the other one is allowed to fall asleep in your bed. I wonder if they could simply take turns. MW one gets to fall asleep in your bed; TTH the other one does. Then on the weekends they can sleep together as a treat. Maybe alternate Sunday nights?

Our switch has made such a difference that when my husband suggested we move #3 out of our room and in with his sister, I refused. Not because I'm not tired of being beat up each night by a 2.5 yr old... but because I can't imagine going back to the "go to sleep" wars.

[Kirsty]

My daughters - aged just 8 and almost 6 - have shared a room since the younger one was about 9 months. Mostly it works fine but yes, there are nights when they lie in bed and chatter and giggle for hours. And yes, the next morning is hellish. But I figure that if we get them to bed at a reasonable time and they don't sleep, it's their problem. We've explained, we've told them what happens, they ignore it. Tough!
Still, basically it works OK and I think it's a great experience for kids to share a room!
So I don't have any advice other than to let them get on with it and hope that they'll eventually figure out for themselves that the best thing to do when you're a tired kid in bed is to sleep!

[Erika]

@ SarcastiCarrie - Too funny. When my sister and I were young, we would fight over who got to sit *behind mom's seat* in the car. (Dad always drove, Mom always sat shotgun.) One day his poor ego had had quite enough, and he turned around and hollered, "You! There. You! Over there. Assigned seats. Now zip it!" Now my sister is 40 and I am 37 and we still sit in our "assigned" seats when we're all in the car together. :)

[maria]

I can't speak to this problem, as I have only the one kid, but I will chime in and say, YEAH, what's up with the crazy sleep stuff the past week or two? Mine (6 yo, daughter) has been getting all wound up at bedtime and doing stuff she used to do a year ago and I thought she'd grown out of - trying to wrestle and jump around after lights out, not responding when I talk to her, etc. etc. Cabin fever? Developmental spurt accompanied by sleep regression? Sleep anxiety? I don't know but it's driving me nuts!

[Cloud]

@Erika, @SarcastiCarrie- yeah, I'm 37, my sister is 39. We still have assigned seats in the car.

[SMC]

My mother did the reading trick with my two little brothers (who were 2.5 years apart). They shared a bunk bed - she turned out the lights, and sat on a chair in the hall and read to them. She read the greatest books. For all of Tolkien, my father and I opened our bedroom doors and listened too. Great memories of that.

[thebigmeow]

Just glad to see that I am not the only one with room-sharing issues!

Mine are 1 and 5 so they have different bedtimes, but also different wake-up times, which is sometimes a problem with the elder waking the younger.

We're doing OK atm though.

[kidelo]

If one kid is 8 and the other 4.5, why are they even going to bed at the same time? Problem solved.

[Raia]

I haven't read the comments, so sorry if this is repetitive. I'd try to work on getting them to dinner more quickly. Can their dad walk them to your place while you are working on dinner? Can you use a crockpot so dinner is ready as soon as you hit the door?

[yasmara]

We are contemplating shifting all 3 BRs in our house to reclaim one as a guest room & put our 2 boys (ages 4.75 & 3) in the biggest room (2nd floor converted attic space) together, using it as a combined BR & playspace. It is exactly this issue that I'm concerned about!

I'm glad to read all the great suggestions. In our case it's Younger Son who takes much, much longer to fall asleep & talks to himself, sings, plays with his "friends" (stuffed animals), etc. for up to an hour before finally going to sleep. Older Son is usually asleep within a few minutes.

We're having a trial room-sharing during our vacation next week & depending on how that goes will figure out when we'll go forward with the Great Room Switching of 2010.

[Ck]

What about the classic game "who can be the quietest for the longest"?!

I remember that trick from my parents when we were kids. It actually worked sometimes.

[Tzipporah]

"Could you be like the old lady whispering hush?"

OK, this is totally unhelpful and not on track, but all I can think of is the Conan Obrien ad that aired a few years ago where he's sitting on the end of a bed, playing guitar, with an old woman in the bed:

Old lady go to sleep, Old lady go to sleep,
Old lady please shut up...

Ah, of course, YOUtube! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bp-j2nmQmGs

[Eveanyn]

Quote Laura:
"Then stagger bedtime, having your older son read or do homework until younger son is asleep. My boys share a room and staggering bedtime has really worked for us. Good luck!"

Send 4 to bed and have 8 stay up and help you with a chore or two (emptying bath trash into kitchen to take out in morn, loading dishwasher). you may have to work past 4 straining to br part of the new routine, but explain that "This is the new schedule so you two get enough sleep".

Don't they say 7 days makes a habit and it takes 30 to break it?

FWIW, I'd ask Dad how he felt about feeding them. If he's a PITA he may balk at financials. If not it gives him a chance to be more involved.

[Steve]

My wife and I are starting a new parenting question and answer site, and this would be a great question to post there! We would be honored if you'd sign up here: http://parentsguild.com/account/register/ and then ask your question here: http://parentsguild.com/post/ask Thanks! Everyone is welcome!

[Kristin]

Something else that may help with dinner sometimes is using a crock pot so they eat earlier and settle down earlier. I agree with PPs that if they can eat at their dads it would be a huge help.

[shelli]

2 bedroom apartment here, too.

The 1.5 year old goes to bed at 6:30; the 4 year old goes to bed at 7:30.

Until they're, oh, 30, same sleep times for shared room just doesn't work.

So adjust for the 4.5 and 8 year old - say, 7:30 and 8:00?

Or, you know, just hope they fall asleep eventually. ;)

[jt307]

I've been slow to read the blog lately. I have a 6 month old so ya know how that goes. I understand the problem from your end. But i have been the older brother in this story, and when my parents divorced when I was 5 and my brother 2.5 we were thrust into a cohabiting situation which lasted till I was 18. With our parents separated and new people (boyfriends, girlfriends, stepdad) entering our life the room sharing and the relationship we built talking about nonsense was the one constant. We weren't having group therapy or counseling sessions from our point of view , although from time to time we did have the lines open to talk about that stuff, and yes we probably made it a bit harder on a single mom some mornings but we are both in our 30's now and are best friends and even though I have my 6 month old and my wife living in Los Angeles and he is running a business in Africa we still manage to talk everyday. I guess what I am saying is without the room sharing he and I would have never developed the bond and we would have ended up like so many siblings being casual acquaintances. Divorce, working parents, travel, shifting schedules, all that is something the boys have zero control over, but they have each other joking and talking nonsense when they should be asleep.

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