Q&A: Second child Shangrila?

Annette writes:

"Am I missing something? I had my second baby (a boy!) 6 weeks ago. My daughter is 3. So far the new baby stage has been tiring and intense, but nowhere near as horrible as it was with my daughter. Even the growth spurts and Gas Wars (DH's term) have been easier to deal with. My daughter is annoyed that I always have the baby attached to me, but she's been doing lots of playdates and seems basically fine with the situation.

I can't shake the feeling, though, that the poop is going to hit the fan one of these days. Don't people go nuts with two kids? Is it just because the baby is so young? I don't want to get cocky and then end up developing PPD later on because things got hard and I wasn't expecting it."

If there was ever a good question for a group to answer, this is it! We need data points.

For me (and my kids were the same age spread as Annette's) the first 2-3 weeks were a piece of cake, comparatively (but then I had a home birth the second time with no tears and a nice snarky midwife and my mom, and my milk came in like gangbusters and he nursed from the get-go, so it was the dream situation and I was grateful for it the entire time and still am). And he was an amazing sleeper from the get-go.

Then the new baby stuff started to kick in, and my little guy was teething in painful rashy earnest from 6 weeks until his first tooth came in at around 6 months. I'd say that the entire first year of my second son's life was really hard for me. Some of that was that my bond with my older one was so strong that it was hard for me to readjust the relationship between the three of us. Also, there was some pretty awful emotional stuff going on with me at the time that cast a pall over that entire time period. I felt truly isolated from my friends because of that emotional stuff, and also because it was just much harder to get out and to participate with the two kids.

It got easier for me, personally, when the kids started to really interact with each other, which was around 10-11 months or so. Strangely, that was the age at which they started to fight a little over toys. But I think that genuine interaction (instead of just the older brother cooing at the baby thing) was when the corner turned.

If you have two or more children, what was your experience of the first however many months with the second child? Mention the age spread of your kids, any circumstances of the birth that would affect the postpartum phase, and anything else you think is relevant.

Comments

[enu]

Two was as easy (?) as one. Because the first started out so intensely challenging... Mine are not quite 2 years apart, second baby was content and undemanding. 2 in diapers was no big deal at all. Sibling rivalry never got beyond the silly stage (you gave her more dryer lint than me!) So the poop may not ever hit the fan. Take it as it comes - not every parent experiences every problem!

[paola]

My kids have 2 years almost to the day between them (my son is now 3 and 3 months, my daughter 15 months).

My opinion on it all was/is much the same as Annette's. The first few weeks were pretty tiring, but nothing like the first time around. My daughter was a great sleeper and pulled her first 7 hours in a row at 2 weeks, so I was certainly not exhausted from lack of sleep. Breastfeeding was a sinch the second time round too, although we did have some fore milk/hind milk issues at around 6 weeks. She then went on to start sleeping 12 hours straight at this time and so things got even easier.

My sons relationship with her was fine in the early weeks, but a little jealousy struck around 2 weeks old when he realised that she wasn't going back to the hospital, but that too worked itself out without too many hiccups as time passed.

The hardest part with baby 2 started classically at 4 months and went on till the 7th month (she started waking at night, A LOT) and so I was getting put thru the ringer a bit. This was a very difficult period as I didn't know what real 'lack of sleep' was until now ( my boy also started sleeping 12 hour nights at 10 weeks).

My daughter was generally pretty grumpy (still is) and so needed a lot of entertainment, which my son helped a lot with. The best time of all was at 8.5 months when she started crawling and she'd crawl off to 'play' with him in the bed-room. Since then their relationship has become stronger and stronger, although we have a 'sibling relationship regression' on our hands now due mainly to my daughters increased interst in my son's toys. Also I think now that my daughter is getting smarter, we tent to compliment her a lot more than before and he is probably starting to feel jealous for the first time since she came along.

So, no, no major hassles here.Having two kids doesn't necessarily mean twice the work, or twice the fun either for that matter, but you have done most of it all before so you certainly are better off this time round

[Kelly]

#1 was 2.25yrs when #2 was born, was very independent and very scared of the baby who was very colicky. Thankfully #1 understood that I had to spend so much time with #2 (lots of bouncing on the ball) and every spare moment I had I spent with #1 (lots of book reading). #2 was a great baby, otherwise, and once the colic got better he became really independent until he started teething. Teething destroyed my tranquility!
#1 stopped sleeping so well (I would too, with all the screaming at night), #2 became Super-Clingy-Boy and has been that way since (he's almost 1.5yrs now). We've learned to adjust and things are better some weeks and worse others. I know there's an end to teething and dream of that day (and dread the molars preceding it).

[Emily]

Our kids are 17 months apart. I know this will sound like an over-simplified theory, but I really think it's all about the personality/temperament of your kids. Our first was unbelievably easy-going, and our second was really tough, really emotional/cranky/high-maintenance/loud until he was two. (Well, he's still all those things - but he's incredibly energetic, verbal, loving and funny now that he's older, so that makes it better!) So, for us, going to two was just - wow ... difficult! And I don't think it was just because they are so close in age. That's my over-simplified theory, but one I've seen play out over and over as our friends have had their second children.

[shirky]

possibilities:
1. Your kung-fu is powerful
2. everyone else is making it up
3. some things will be hard, some easy, and six weeks is just the beginning

I'm on the side of #3 but #1 is good too right?

[Mar]

Mine are 17 months apart and the Younger is now just about 4 months. I am finding managing two MUCH easier than I'd anticipated, though not without its challenges. The hardest part for me is missing my one-on-one time with the Older and managing his grief at losing that as well. Fortunately, the Younger is an incredibly easy baby (so far - he turns 4 months next week) and the Older resumed his easy going ways after the first two weeks or so. I do still run interference a few times a day, but it is now easier to predict when the Older will get bored and take it out on the Younger.

Working in my favor, I think, is that I had been SO anxious about this period of having two under two (the Younger was a surprise) that the fact that we're managing comes as a huge relief. Another benefit the second time around is that my husband and I and work really well together, having worked out all the kinks when we were first time parents - labor is easily divided and we can both anticipate (usually) when someone needs to step in. I'm also so relieved to have two happy healthy kids at home. Perhaps because I felt we'd gotten lucky with the Older (who was pretty easy), I was poised to have a more challenging baby the second time around. The Younger is just such a delight that I'm constantly feeling so blessed and lucky (so much luck) that our birth control wasn't quite up to snuff that night...

[Missy]

My first two are 21 months apart. I think I have to agree with the temperament theory Amy put out there. My first one was a difficult newborn (nursing was not great, never wanted to be put down or sleep alone), but seriously the world's easiest toddler (she's 6 now and still such an easy kid). Baby #2 was the easiest newborn (nursed like a pro from the get-go, slept great, very content), but a very challenging toddler (taking your eyes off him for a minute could have resulted in him standing in the toilet or on the kitchen counter holding wineglasses. Umm, not that had happened). So the first year with 2 kids was pretty easy. If those two had been switched around, I may have gone insane.

I think it is easier to parent a second child because you have experience and perspective, and you've already made the life altering adjustment of becoming a parent. But a high needs baby, a challenging toddler, sleep deprivation, or post partum depression can make parenting difficult no matter if it is your first or your fifth.

[rudyinparis]

I remember before Younger arrived feeling really overwhelmed by the logisitics of hauling two children around, versus just one. Then she was with us, and it worked itself out. The difficulty, we've found (DH and I) is really after that first blush wears off--once you're well into it and deep in the weeds. I wouldn't say this to my buds that just have one, and I feel like I shouldn't say it, but the truth is there is a day to day grind with two that is at least a little more intense than with one. To put it mildly. There have been days when I think: Oh my God, how can we keep doing this *for years to come*. The incessant demands, while understandable (due to their lack of abilities)--well, it's exhausting. Eldest had an overnight this past weekend and we kept saying "Having one is like having none at all!" We were blown away by the difference in the demands on our time and energy. (I don't really means "demands" to sound as negative as it does, but it really is the only word.) So Annette, enjoy every day as it comes and know that some days will be tough. But then, some days are tough with just one, and some days are tough for people that don't have kids at all. And one last note: is there any greater joy than watching your two children play together and love each other? More than ample reward for the work.

[Missy]

I meant Emily, not Amy. Sorry!

[Melissa]

My girl is 3, boy is almost 10 months. The first two months were okay. Not easy, mind you, but the problems were just typical new baby stuff--we even traveled cross-country with both kids! Then my son's reflux and allergies kicked in and the next 6-7 months were the hardest of my life, what with getting no sleep, dealing with my daughter going through the twos, and being on a total elimination diet for months. We are just coming out of the woods now. But whoever said it has to do with temperament is probably right. If my son had been the easy baby he is now, having two would have been a breeze and I would be ready for a third!

[michelle]

I have a 3.5 year old daughter and a 6 month old boy. True, I have been less anxious with no. 2...but everything else has been harder.

For me, it is just the particular combined circumstances of baby no. 2 that are much more trying than the first time around. Baby wakes to nurse twice a night (his older sister slept through at 4 months), he was born in October when I couldn't get outside much (his sister was born in June and I took a walk every day), all my friends were at work this time around (with no. 1, I had a good friend who also happened to be on maternity leave and could hang out).

Finally, I hate to say it, but my older daughter didn't really bug out about not getting all the attention until baby was 3 or 4 months old. So...things could still get tricky for her in the sibling rivalry department.

[Mom In France]

Thanks for all your comments. We're trying for number two now that Boo turned 1 and I'm anxious as all get-out. I mean, I want want want a family of two, and Boo has been relatively easy (good sleeper and eater), but I'm worried about handling number two and losing my one-on-one time with Boo. It feels better knowing that I'm not the only one with these anxieties and I'm reassured we can manage (and even enjoy it!).

[Jen]

I agree with Emily and rudyinparis.

I think it has a lot to do with temperament. Our older daughter (2 yrs, 5 mos when #2 was born) was a more difficult baby (wanted to be held a lot, fussy, didn't sleep anywhere close to through the night until 10 1/2 months). Ans she still is "spirited". Baby #2 is a breeze. So much so that her day care provider is constantly commenting on how easy she is. But she's only 3 1/2 months, so who knows what the future holds.

As for rudyinparis's comment - I was thinking a similar thing this weekend. In fact, I was feeling a bit overwhelmed, wondering when I would ever have fun again. That's not to say that there aren't fun moments in our lives, but sometimes all the demands just beat you down. Throw a defiant toddler in the mix and one can feel downright bummed out from time to time.

[Slim]

1 & 2 are 3 years apart. Delivery of #2 was horrible, and while Boy 1 was thrilled with his brother, he was freaked by how sick I was. We got back on track and things got easier, then got hard again at (I think) about 4 months, when I went back to work and felt overwhelmed a lot of the time. So that was probably me.
Also, though, I think there was a loss of harmony as the baby became mobile and toy-snatching. My first is very much of the saintly cooperative mold, so he would allow the snatching because-he's-just-a-baby-and-doesn't-know-better, but I think that built up resentment that came out in other ways.

[Cybele]

nothing to contribute but reading this post with interest. I always wanted 2 kids but #1 (10 mon) is so hard! I'm grateful that he's healthy and happy but I feel like I've had every other problem in the book -sleep, nursing, high maintenance, stubborn, etc. (and it just keeps going...like, now that's he's weaning, he's becoming a difficult picky eater). I know things could still change but right now it feels like there's no extra bandwidth to add another baby to the mix. I'm almost 37 and the bio clock is ticking, though. We'll see.

[AmyInAustin]

Boy and Girl are 1 year and 49 weeks apart and so far (almost 4 months), it has been about 800% better. The kind of better that can't be explained by a learning curve. It has been enough better that I, like the OP, have been commenting on it and polling my friends. My investigations have led me to this:
#1 It has become clear to my that I was suffering from medium/severe PPD. I never wanted to hurt anyone, but I definitely felt completely hopeless and like the rest of my life was going to be this awful black abyss with maybe the occasional respite from neverending duty and chores and nursing and going to bed at 7 every night yet still being toally wiped out and never having another cocktail and always having a messy house and never seeing my friends. I got rid of all the vintage dresses that I have spent a lifetime finding, mending, culling and looking totally cute in. Where would I wear them? My backyard? I thought that was the trade off for having children. A few months before I had my second child (you may ask why I was having 2, when I was having so many problems with one. The short answer: I don't know. Long answer: things eased up after the first year, I lost some weight, got all "hot and junk," and it seemed like we could handle it.), several of my friends had their first and they all seemed to be handling the whole thing so gracefully. And they were happy. And they weren't complaining about being tired all the time, or that their kids cried constantly. So I started to think that something was really wrong with me. Maybe perhaps I am someone who is not cut out to be a parent. Which would really suck, since #2 was on the way. Well, to make a long, rambling story longer, #2 came and it was like night and day. Not even. It was like night and a lollipop. So different that it is inexplicable as to how something that is ostensibly the same action -- giving birth and taking care of an infant -- could be so different this time. Which is when I came up with a retrospective diagnosis of PPD. It's the only thing that can explain it to me. I mean, sure this one sleeps better and cries less. And I've (mostly) made the adjustment from 36-year-old Hip Kid (haha) to gray-haired parent (there are a lot of us in Austin, let us show you our iPods). So those obstacles aren't there. But other ones are. Mostly process and finances. Piffle and nonsense, comparatively.
#2 There is no #2, my eyes were bigger than my tummy on that.
So anyways, that is my explanation of shangri-la with the second child. Maybe you can rule out PPD. In that case, I got nothing for ya.

[paola]

Oh, I forgot to mention, no PPD with number two( by far the BESTEST thing about the second time ).

Re: getting-round logistics, when they are close in age, tandem pushers/strollers are just the best way to get around and get things done. My Graco Stadium Duo was the best ever investment. When Elder got too big for it, I was devastated and wondered how I'd ever be able to manage. Turned out to not be a big problem as he likes a good walk

[rby]

I have two just less than two years apart, and like lots of other commenters, I've been pleasantly surprised by how smoothly it's gone so far (my daughter is 9 months old). I actually found the first few weeks to be crazy-making, with the day and night confusion, but once my daughter started sleeping more at night at two or three weeks, things fell into place. For me, it's all about the sleep: I get lots more sleep with two than I did with just my son the first year of his life.

I did worry a lot about how I would handle two and especially how my son would deal with a sibling. He's very intense, and I worried that he'd have a hard time adjusting, but he seemed to barely notice the baby for months and months, probably because she is fairly easygoing and didn't demand all my time and energy and because we live in the same town as my parents, and they lavished tons of attention on him. He's also quite a small kid and not very physical, and I think the experience of being the older sibling, the one who's bigger and can do more, has been a confidence booster for him.

Still, as rudyinparis said, as much as I feel it's been very smooth with two, it's amazing how their needs just fill every spare inch of space in your day. One seems just unspeakably easy in comparison. For example, with one, I worried so much about traveling, but I've taken the baby with me several times now on cross-country plane trips, and it feels like a vacation compared to flying with a toddler. That's another good thing about two: I couldn't even measure the degree to which I feel more relaxed and confident about parenting. Lucky second kid.

[Julie]

Yes, I am watching this thread with all my attention today. We are trying for #2 and I'm gathering as much information as possible. Alex will (hopefully) be 3 - 3 1/2 when little one is born and will be firmly intrenched in an all-day preschool (hooray!!! we got in!!!!) so I'm hoping that will help a lot. One of my best friends had this same situation and she said the all-day preschool saved her life (same school - though I think any place where older can go and be him or her own true self away from all the newness and crying would help). I asked her if older was jealous that she was home all day with baby and she said she really didn't talk about what she did all day....one time he might have asked if she was working and she said "My work right now is to take care of M" and older seemed to be okay with that. As an older kid, I can imagine he was eager to be doing interesting things at school as opposed to watching mommy nurse and take naps and try to find a time to shower. It's not like she was taking the baby to Disneyland or anything.

Please keep the data points coming....and also handy tips anyone might have for juggling two.

[AmyinMotown]

Annette, I am in almost the exact same situation as you (except my little guy is 8 weeks). Like, I was reading and thought "Did I write to Moxie in my sleep?" We've had our blips--he''s had a cold almost continuously, and it's been super cold and snowy here so hard to get out, and my daughter keeps saying "Can you put him DOWN?" when I am trying to comfort him and play with her. OH YEAH, and I realized when I started crying every day at two weeks postpartum that something was bad and went to my fab OB and got on medication, which has worked. And I am having trouble getting the amount of work done that I need to (I freelance and started back at four weeks. Which was too damn early). And my house is a sty and my thank you notes are late and my friends must all think I suck because I can't find time to return a damn phone call --but I know this too shall pass.It did last time and I got to a point I could manage life again.

But all this same stuff just swamped me with my daughter. This time, I think it's easier because I have already undergone that crazy identity shift and enormous lifestyle change in becoming a mother. I am already used to the level of demand and lack of sleep and putting my own needs aside, and my husband and I have gotten used to dealing with each other as co parents without losing the ""friends and lovers" part as well. I don't always love it, but I am used to it.

Also? MUCH easier baby (and my daughter was pretty much a cakewalk too). He sleeps, he never cries unless he's gassy, and he didn't even go through the 3-to-6 week fussy period that makes you want to kill yourself or run away from home. The luck of the draw this time, we drew an easy baby (I am a FIRM believer that they are the way they are and parenting can only do so much at this phase, so I am not bragging here).

Which leads into another reason it's easier this time: I KNOW now that your child makes you tear your hair out at some point. My daughter was a fairly easy baby, a mostly delightful toddler, somewhat challenging at two and HOLY GOD is three killing me. Luckily she's also funny, loving, charming and one of my favorite people on this Earth or I'd routinely put Bailey's in my morning coffee. So I know to enjoy the easy baby I have now because at some point I'm going to be facing down HellBoy.

Also, Moxie, you said something I need to chew on, about your bond being so strong with your oldest that it was hard for you to readjust the relationship. That perfectly put into words one of my big struggles over these last couple months, balancing being there for my daughter with making sure my son gets the love and attention he needs.

So yeah, not "easy" per se but easier? Hell yes. And yes, the shit will hit the fan eventually but then it will even itself out, just like it likely did with your first.

[JB]

Mine are 2.5 years apart (my son just turned six months) and so far, it's been pretty good. My main tip for two kids is -- make sure your partner is as involved as you are! A 2:1 parent:child ratio is a snap. 1:1 and you still have them outgunned because you're bigger. Having two kids has given me HUGE respect for single parents -- if I had a 1:2 ratio, I just have no idea how I would possibly cope.

One thing that was different for me was that we adopted our daughter at 8.5 months, so I never had the newborn stage with her. Birth, postpartum stuff, nursing, and the early developmental stuff has all been new. I've never had a 6-month-old. So the learning curve was still there for me. Overall, it hasn't been horrible; our son doesn't sleep through the night and I'm VERY tired by now, but he's sweet and easygoing and only fusses when there's something wrong (hungry, tired, teething.) It's been more satisfying than I could have imagined, too. I never pictured myself doing this, but I feel so lucky.

[Mindy]

I've got to support the temperament thing again. My first two were two years and two days apart. I was literally out of my mind for a year after that. My then 2-year-old would stand in front of me and scream "No, Henry, drink the milk!!!!!!" every time I nursed for months. Every grocery store trip ended with a tantrumming 2-year-old and a weepy mom. I felt totally out of control and exhausted.
I'm now on #3. Yes, he's an easy baby and sleeps and eats, but the main difference is my daughter, the high-maintenance child from birth, is in school. My 3-year-old, Henry, loves the baby and is simply not a tantrum-having kid. His reaction to the baby coming home from the hospital? He potty-trained himself. Really, it was my oldest child who was the challenge the first time. As her pre-K teacher said "She's rather finely-tuned, isn't she?" And, boy, do I love that finely-tuned kid. I would not want her any other way.

[kelli]

I have three: 4, 2, 3.5 months. The kids are 2 years 10 days apart and 2 years 1 month apart in age.

I think it really depends on the personality of the kids AND the parents. #1 was pretty easy going -- there were fussy periods during the day, but he nursed well (even though he was 3 weeks early), and was pretty easy going. My husband and I are pretty relaxed people, so we just go with the flow. I think that's worked in our favor.

#1 didn't seem to mind how much time I spent on the couch nursing #2 -- #1 would bring over his bear and nurse, or drive his cars on "Boppy Road" or draw on his MagnaDoodle. It was when #2 started to grab his toys that it became a problem. It was a beautiful day when my two sons were playing outside in the yard and I could spy on them cooperating and giggling together.

Now we have #3 and she's a good nurser and sleeper, and the boys only seem to mind the amount of time I spend with her when they want "to eat RIGHT NOW!!" or they're having a fight -- the fights have gotten more physical, but that's mostly because #2 doesn't have the vocabulary or the practice in using words when he's upset, so he'll poke & grab instead. And #1 will just lay on top of him. (It's funny, but we don't laugh. Really!)

The hardest thing is getting everyone fed when they're hungry and cranky, getting everyone naps (#1 refuses, #2 needs someone to lay down with him, #3 is getting into a pattern of naps), getting through dinner & evening routine to get everyone in bed at a reasonable hour, and getting everyone ready and in the car in time for preschool (3 mornings a week for #1, 1 morning a week for #2 with me & #3, too.) -- everything takes longer and fills up the day. Just going through the store (I TRY to only take 2 kids at a time) takes twice as long as it would if I were alone. Of course, if I were alone, I might make it last at least that long...

[Michelle]

Great topic! Mine are 15 months apart (not on purpose - the universe has a Sense of Humor). My son (oldest) was definitely a tougher newborn...colic, a mild-moderate case of PPD, and just new-mom "what the hell have I gotten myself into" stuff.

Like Moxie, my second was born at home and I think that (along with 15 months of practice) made the transition to 2 a lot easier for me. She has been a more mellow baby since the very beginning, although I will say that those initial sleepless nights plus chasing a toddler all day were a bit rough.

Now she is 9 months old and Oldest is 2 years and 1 month. They are just starting to interact and I have noticed that giving me an extra 5 minutes here and there plus we can double up on meals, baths, etc and that helps immensely.

Having two this close is fun and exhausting and amazing all at the same time.

[mollyball]

i have a 21-month old and a 4.5 month old, and i really think it all has to do with the personalities of the children, and the parents too--how could it not? my husband and i have just accepted the fact that our DNA combines to create screaming rage-balls, and we're hoping we're rewarded with easy teenagers or something. my eldest stands next to the baby and screams whenever i nurse her or rock her to sleep, and that is just about the most trying thing i have ever endured. also that whole easy second born thing isn't really panning out for us--number 2 is a firstborn trapped inside a secondborn's body. she wants a lot of alone time with me, and a lot of deluxe rocking to sleep. it's my theory that it's the fact that she's missing some of this during the day that keeps her up all night. i've never been a cry it out person, but i've had to let her cry while i'm bathing the firstborn, or putting the firstborn to bed for example, and i'm here to say that cry it out is not the magic bullet i've sometimes heard it is. my secondborn will cry for as long as it takes me to finish dealing with my firstborn. like really, as long as it takes. occasionally she'll fuss herself to sleep for a nap, but doing that a few times a week makes her no more likely to put herself back to sleep at 3:00 in the morning. i'm pretty tired. but it's such a short period of life, and i think it's kind of funny actually. when i'm trying to nurse the second, and the first is screaming, and the second is screaming because she wants to nurse in a quiet room with mood lighting, i have to laugh at how bad (and LOUD) it is. sort of hysterical laughter, but still laughter. in a way, i respect my second for sticking up for herself. i mean, why shouldn't she get to be rocked to sleep just because she showed up second? i love my sassy rage-ball kids. though they've sort of killed any interest i had in having 3 kids. maybe 2 rage-balls is the same as 3 normal kids? anyway, all this to say that it's about the personalities of the kids, in my opinion. isn't that the way of adult life as well? it's all about personality, but it's the differences between us that make life interesting.

[mollyball]

i meant that 2 rage balls are like 3 normal kids in terms of how tiring they are; not that rage balls are better. non-rage balls are great too--don't get me wrong. i wasn't dissing the non-rage.

[Mar]

Mollyball - you're a month ahead of me exactly (i have a 20 mo and 3.5 mo) and you have a MUCH better attitude than i would in your shoes. It all does come down to personalities and luck of the draw. I should have included that in my comment above -- my experience is easier than I'd anticipated b'c the kids are easier than I'd feared. But even with non-rage balls, the second is forced to put up with a lot of lag time before I get a few consecutive minutes to feed him (and even my mellow guy doesn't take that quietly -- and who wouldn't prefer mood lighting?). Good luck with the rage (and fatigue) of all concerned!

[Suki]

Wow these comments are so great. Mollyball your 'rageball' term made me laugh out loud. I can't believe I will say this but I will: Sometimes, I have felt cheated because I have a baby who is a lot of work to entertain, and he is often grumpy and cranky and clingy, and I am just not as happy as other moms seem to be. (he is 14.5 months now). But, reading these comments, I realize I'm not alone. Thanks everyone...

[PumpkinMama]

Mine are 3.5 years apart. I had that same feeling as the person asking the question and keep waiting for "the poop to hit the fan" and it still hasn't and the baby is now 16mos. old. This time is just so freakin' easy - it helps that the first time was really brutal, with PPD, colic and a generally very high needs baby (he is still high needs at almost 5). My daughter is just a breezy easy going girl. It scares me because I now think I could handle three kids, but there are no guarantees that a 3rd would be so easy.

[Sara]

Mine are 3yrs 4 mos apart.

The first year was great! We made sure he got plently of quality time, we would sometimes tell the baby "Now, you have to wait a minute because I am helping Primo with his thing here." (advice someone gave me - when the baby is just fine and not immediately needing something, tell baby within toddler's hearing that BABY is the one that iwll have to wait).

And then baby got big and got mobile, and one day in the car, Primo asked "Mamma, when are we goign to take Secunda back to the hospital and get a different baby?"

Right now (ages 8 and 4) he'll play with her if he's desparate for companionship, but mostly its so unfair that she exists.

And for those trying to get the perfect spacing? Its not about the age difference. It's about something you get even LESS say about. "Mom? Why couldn't I have a little BROTHER like Bobby does? His mom had a baby BOY!"

[PC]

My girls are two years and two weeks apart. The first four months were a lot easier than expected but once the youngest moved out of the "baby bucket" stage, things became a lot harder. Both of my kiddos have strong personalities and know exactly what they want and don't want. My youngest,who is now one, has food allergies and reflux and has never slept through the night. We are very tired parents.

We wouldn't change it for the world but the addition of a second child really makes our lives hectic. Both of our kids are very strong willed and independent. Downtime is nonexistent because no matter what we try nap times don't really overlap. Someone is always up by 6am and the oldest falls asleep around 8pm. By the time cleaning and organizing for the next day is over, it is 11pm.

Now that my youngest is walking things have gotten a bit easier. She really likes to keep up with her older sister and walking helps alleviate some of the frustration she had when she wasn't mobile.

I find that when I have just one of the kids to care for, it is a piece of cake. Nothing like I thought it was when my oldest was an only.

I still want a third though my husband thinks I am nuts.

Another issue we deal with is allocation of attention by grandparents. They still shower the oldest with attention and sometimes neglect our youngest because she doesn't talk and can't "do" as much. All four of them are guilty of it and because we all live in the same town, it is very obvious. We have no idea what to do about it and only hope it subsides once our youngest gets a bit older.

[other Emily]

Just wanted to say that I am watching this with great interest, as #2 is due to arrive at the end of July, when #1 will be just past 2.5.

[Jen]

Oh boy! I am very much interested in this as I cannot decide on No. 2 or not.

I have The World's Easiest Baby - due to nothing I've done, just luck of the draw- and yet I still find that I am not coping well. Not sure why. She is not quite a year old. I work FT.

I look at this beautiful, sweet little girl. I see how she sleeps like a dream, is healthy, doing everything that she "should be doing" and yet I think "how could I do this again?" And, then I think, "WTF is wrong with me that I think this is hard, when I know others deal with far more than I am." I'm constantly stressed and anxious. Constantly second guessing myself. Usually poor hubs in on the receiving end. (Have to work on that).

I think logistics. How do you get an infant to nap when you have a toddler around? How do you get ready for work in the am with TWO? How do you do anything with two? I am a bit type-A, as you can prob tell.

Being pregnant and delivery. I'd do it again in a second. But, I'm finding I don't "do" the baby stage well. (Well, I -as in me- don't do it well; she's thriving and happy.)

Then there's the "what is best for her" thing? No guarantee she and a sibling will like each other (my own situation bears that out). But, to leave her an only child and something happens to us . . . she'll have no one.

I also thought that I would always have a second. And in my mid-30s, I can't take all the time in the world to decide. Hubs says it's up to me, and he is wonderfully supportive about everything.

Just. Don't. Know.

[Jan]

I was one who adjusted with not much difficulty to the first one. I never even once had those fleeting 'I can't do this' thoughts.

Mine are just over a year and a half apart. We didn't experience much in the way of sibling rivalry when the younger was a baby; that kicked in more when he started to have an opinion of his own -- maybe 9 months to a year?

He (my second) was reasonably easy to sleep train (I use that to mean teach him to sleep at night, etc, NOT to mean letting him cry, which we did not have to do the second time 'round).

My husband was, at the time, self-employed, so he was available to help out when I needed it, but he was also catapulting into wound up as a major depressive episode, so I don't know whether I should count his presence as a help or a hindrance. Some of both, honestly.

Now, almost 2 1/2 years into having two, I can't quite remember what it was that was so hard about it, but I do recall having some days where I was overwhelmed with a desire to lock myself in a closet and cry.

One of the awesome things is that NOW, now that I'm used to two, if I get to have a day with just one, it's practically like having a day off. It feels so simple and easy-going. I love it.

I have no qualms about caring for a third now; I think the one-to-two hump is definitely the hardest.

One, one piece of advice: whatever else you do with sleep, get that younger one into the habit of taking a nap in the afternoon at whatever time the older one does. Seriously. By the time that kid was a week old, we were on that train. I still don't care where else it overlaps, what time other stuff has to happen, NAPTIME STARTS AT 1. For them both. My almost-4-year-old doesn't always sleep, but she spends an hour or so in her room quietly looking at books (or loudly singing lullabies to her babies -- I DON'T CARE) so that I can sit down with my lunch and watch 20 minutes of mindless TV or take a cat nap or even occasionally enjoy a nooner with the longsuffering other adult member of the household.

[Sarah]

@Jen -- I feel exactly as you do. I don't have the easiest baby but he is not high needs either. Has always slept beautifully, no colic, no teething issues, great nurser from get-go, good eater etc. He's over one year now. I don't know if I want another either. I would love to give birth again but haven't loved the first year. I just don't think it's that fabulous to care for a baby 7 days a week. Do I really want to go through it all again? Hubs also says he's happy either way. I don't know. Just wanted to let you know you're not alone... Oh - I am also very type A :)

[martha]

I am reading with such interest - I have a 17 month old and am 27 weeks pregnant with #2. I am considered "high risk" and not very mobile now. I am feeling so very guilty about not being able to be out and about with my daughter and worried that it will be more of the same for her when her brother arrives.

#1 was 6 weeks early with lots of eating problems and born in Nov - so we were very isolated due to the cold. She was on an every 2 hour feeding schedule 24 hours a day for over 3 months and I was exhausted (incoherent actually) and very depressed.

She is now a pathologically happy toddler and we are very close. She will be about 20 months when #2 is born and I worry about how both of us will adjust. I am guessing much will depend on the birth circumstances of #2 and my PPD status.

I have been told that it is easier to have a newborn and a toddler than to be pregnant and have a toddler... I am just trying to keep my head up for now.

Thank you all so very much for your thoughts.

[Amy]

Mine are 2 yrs 3 mos apart. The first 6 weeks with #2 were a nightmare b/c she had her days and nights confused, but it was just the sleep deprivation that got me... not having two of them. It didn't feel like double the work (if I recall correctly). When I had #3 last year I was totally prepared for another "shangrila"-- everyone will be happy and adjust and I will be super-mom.

And the poop really did hit the fan. #2 was very jealous; #3 was very needy; I didn't seem to be able to get anything done or to get the gang out of the house for long-periods without us all melting down. Your basic nightmare. Things are much easier now that #3 is nearly a year old. But that early "shangrila" still eludes me.

[zenjen]

DH and I are in the middle of discussing having #2.

#1 is in that "I'm almost 16 mos. old and I want to cling/tantrum/cry/be held/eat/no not hungry for that/no no put me down" stage and isn't very verbal. My wish would be to wait until that magic 21 month mark before getting pregnant with #2. I just think I want to get to the point where #1 is more verbal and able to manage at least small chunks of time playing on his own without me being 2 feet away.

But then again, one can plan and it doesn't always work out, right?

[sue]

ack, no time to read the comments today :-( here are my data points -

my daughter is just about exactly 2.5 years older than my son. I think the relative ease has a lot to do with temperament. My daughter was colicky for MONTHS, never ever slept, cried all the time, and I had mild/moderate ppd that I refused to admit at the time. and we had a terrible time breastfeeding and eventually quit, and had trouble bonding as a result. good times. my son was a nice easy baby whose only demand was that he be allowed to nure 24/7. I was so happy he didn't scream all the time and was willing to sleep if his demands were met that it was a breeze (this hs come back to bite me now that he is 13 mos and still won't sleep without a nipple in his mouth. oh well, either he'll grow out of it, or I'll let him start dating way before I plan to ;-). breastfeeding went well and no ppd. so, in a lot of ways, having two was easier than having one, since my evil evil baby gew up to be a pretty reasonably toddler, and then i had an easy baby as the second.

but, the poop may eventually hit the fan - older is now 3.5 and younger is 13.5 mos - i think i spend all day long trying to keep them from beating each other and ripping up each other's toys. sometimes i feel like i hand out time-outs like halloween candy.

[violingirl]

My boys are 21 months apart, currently at 2 years 6 months and 9 months old. Our second was in the NICU for a week after he was born, so all of the work we did prepping our older son for his brother kind of got thrown out the window. When we brought the baby home my older son didn't care for awhile, and the first few weeks were easy for me as far as caring for the boys, but hard emotionally because I was not at all prepared to have a sick newborn. Just when I was starting to get over the emotional stuff Our older one became extremely jealous- trying to hide the baby, yelling at me to put him down all the time, trying to hit the baby- it didn't seem to matter how much alone time he got with mama or daddy. After about 6 weeks that faded and now they crack each other up and are doing really well together. I did fine handling both of them until the little one started to crawl, now I'm really tired keeping after him (he's such a nosy little guy! Has to touch everything!) but life is generally good with both of them. I have been having a lot of problems with PPD since little one was about 3 months old. I suspect it has more to do with the timing of everything- having a baby, my business doubling in the last year, my husband changing careers and going back to school, and moving to a new house, all in the last 9 months. I do not handle minor change well, so all this upheaval for the last 9 months has really done a number on me. But I'm working on it, and things continue to improve, and that's good enough for me.

[DC Ranger]

I'm reading the comments with great interest, because seriously, I feel like the 2nd child issue is all I think about these days.

@ mollyball, I burst out laughing here at work thanks to you. "Rage-ball" - hee! That describes my 21-month old son to a T. I only wish I had mollyball's easygoing attitude about it because it would make life a lot easier. I loved being pregnant, and in theory, I would love to have a 2nd child, but the experience of parenting this seriously intense, temperamental, LOUD little person (who, oh, BTW, regularly tries to shove & head-butt the smaller babies at daycare because he's pissed at no longer being the youngest kid there...just imagine the sibling rivalry) has made me question whether I can handle another child without losing my mind completely, not to mention causing my marriage to go up in flames. Hubby has a similarly intense personality so I blame this all on him (just kidding! well, sort of) and I guess there's always a chance that kiddo #2 could be quiet like me, but the possibility that we'll create a 2nd high-needs kid petrifies me.

I totally identified with Jen & Sarah. I have "WTF" moments frequently, where I wonder what's wrong with me, and I think, is it really that my kid is so intense, or would I not be coping well no matter what kind of child I had? Why can other people manage 4 kids while I can't deal with just one? But I hate the thought of leaving my son without a sibling, and since I'm in my late 30s, I can't keep postponing this.

I just don't know either, and have no clue what to do about it.

[charis]

My older daughter was 2.5 when my younger daughter was born. For me, the second baby was easier because I knew what I was doing. I had many of the same issues with the second kid -- c-section, low milk supply, to name two. But I knew what was happening, and I knew how to do it this time. Also, I think 2.5 was a good age for my older. She was just getting into the whole "I'll-do-it-myself" thing, which coincided nicely with my inability to help her as much as I had before.

Things got a little more dicey around the time she turned three. She got the crazy, irrational, tantruming threes, and it drove me nuts (this type of behavior was completely new for her.) Once we got through that, and the girls could start interacting, it did get better. The older loves to "mommy" the younger (which can be good and bad), and the younger loves to watch and immulate the older. So it's gotten easier.

Now, my younger is getting to 18 months, and she's developing a huge willful streak (that my older never had), so that's something new and, um, challenging to deal with. It's all ups-and-downs, I guess.

[Jill in Atlanta]

Mine are also 3y apart. The start was easy- my son pretty much ignored the new baby and I tried to give him as much attention as possible. (note to self: he DID un-potty train himself, "easy" maybe not quite acurate). However, when that boring baby started to crawl, all hell broke loose. The baby knocked down block towers, wrecked Lego structures and drove big brother mad. Literally. It didn't get better until the baby started to talk much much later.

[Kateri]

My girls are 3 yrs 2 months apart. my second was a quiet, placid, go anywhere baby until she hit 24 months, when she discovered her stubborn side.

in the beginning it wasn't as hard as i thought it would be, and i felt that way for a good year and a half. but now? a two year old and a five year old who are into the same kinds of things and spend a lot of time together, who both have strong personalities and decided opinions, let's just say that there's a lot of screaming and drama. a LOT. and it makes having just one kid look like...kind of a joke. with one kid there's nothing to negotiate, and that's what i spend 90% of my mommy time doing these days. extinguishing emotional infernos.

[Jamie]

I have two - one is four and the other is almost eight months. So far, it has been a breeze, in comparison to what I was expecting. With #1, I had some PPD, and DS had horrible reflux for which it took us three months to find the appropriate medication. For the first two months of his life, he would not sleep for more than 45 minutes at a time on his back due to the reflux, and I was a sobbing wreck for months. Once we got the reflux under control, he became the easiest baby and was a joyful toddler (age 3 on the other hand...). With #2, I had some fertility issues, so the fact that she is even alive and breathing fills me with tremendous joy and gratitude and makes things bearable even in the hard times. #2 is also an incredibly easy, happy baby, and my four year old seems to experience her as if she is also "his" baby, so I think it helps that he has annointed himself as the "third parent" (i.e. not physically caring for her, but in comments like "bring E over here so she can be a part of the family," "look at what I can do to make her laugh", etc.)
I am loving life with two, and find it so much less overwhelming than it was with one-- partially b/c she is so easy and partially b/c I'm already used to my life being so drastically different than it was pre-kids. It's just more of the same, seriously! The logistics of getting everyone out the door and working around the nap schedules are challenging, but otherwise, it's just go with the flow.
I'm looking forward to #3 (not quite ready yet, however).

[Kate]

My kids are 22 months apart, and my baby boy is 2 years old today! My daughter will be 4 in June.

Both kids were long labors and C-section deliveries, but were good nursers and that aspect of mothering has (*poo poo poo*) pretty much been a breeze for me, although tandem nursing has had its challenges.

First month home, my daughter basically ignored my son. Which we thought was super, because we didn't know if we would have to fear for his safety.

But other stuff--so many diapers, so many needs to be fulfilled right this second, not enough hands when my husband was at work. It can be hard. I have (still) not slept 6 hours in a row--not since Sept 2003 (when I discovered I was pregnant with #1). The sleep deprivation is a killer.

I agree with whoever said 3 years old is harder than 2 years old--my daughter stopped napping at 3y2m (the kids had a pretty coordinated afternoon nap for at least a year), and though she is in school for several hours every weekday, she is always challenging and pushing boundaries. She is very headstrong. This past year has been very hard for me and her, leaving out of it her relationship with her brother (although I'm sure that's part of the reason why it's been so hard).

With two, I've found that when it's good, it's *great* (they climb into bed together and "read" books for 15+ minutes! they giggle together in the car! they watch PBS Kids cuddled together on the couch!), and when it's bad, there is a lot of crying, pushing, toy grabbing, parent policing, and me falling into the trap of giving negative attention to whoever is the instigator. This might be exacerbated by the fact that my son has a speech delay, so I find it hard to let the two of them just work it out themselves as long as nobody winds up bleeding. But that day will be good, when it comes. For now I spend a lot of time whining, "Can't you just get along?"

Quite often, though, I still don't have enough hands. And I've had it pretty easy individually, but I don't know if I could add another personality to the mix. Because the mix is what's dominating my life.

[hedra]

Four kids: First two 4 years apart, next 3 years apart, last two 5 minutes apart.

Really struggled to adapt to one. Two was easy, hard, easy, hard, easy, hard, with the balance toward LOVE it.

Four from two was hard, HARD, hard, HARD, wonderful, HARD, fun, HARD, and now is starting to get easier.

The relationships continue to change and adapt, shift, rotate, clash, mesh, tandem up, swap (like, total personality swaps!), ease, flex, break, grow back, expand, link up, coordinate, dysregulate, and everything in between. It's a melange. A total mangle some days, other days everyone pulling together.

And I still love it. It's crazy to love it, but I do. And the more the youngest two get into the 3-year-old autonomy, the better it gets. Granted, I still crash and burn as a mom, regularly. But overall, one was hard and good, two was good and relatively easy, and four is a wealth of everything (good and bad, hard and easy).

[mollyball]

wait, maybe i'm not that easygoing. my oldest kid just had a meltdown on the stairs because i wouldn't pick her up because i was carrying the baby, and all 3 of us ended up sitting on the stairs and crying. it took us 45 minutes to get upstairs, and my oldest had a giant diaper of poop. i think i just sounded easygoing in that moment. now i'm dreading doing bedtime on my own (husband is out of town). hey, moms of 2: how do you get a fussy baby and a toddler into bed at the end of the day? that's not a riddle--i really want to know.

[meggiemoo]

I have a 2+ year old and am TTC presently. My DS was a seriously high-needs baby (at my 6-week OB appointment, when my midwife mentioned birth control, I was like, "YES!!! Please. Whatever kind you have."

Now he's a total delight. Maybe difficult babies are easier later? Who knows. I've wondered whether we would get another non-sleeper. God, I hope not. Not sure I can handle not sleeping more than 4 hours in a row for a whole year.

[Charisse]

@Jen, Sarah, and DC Ranger, #1 is turning 4 this week and no plans for #2 here, but just wanted to say I totally identify too. It's always seemed like it ought to be easier for me (healthy kid, supportive husband, flexible job) than it is.

Then again if I had another maybe I'd be pleasantly shocked like the OP...but I don't think feelings like ours are all that uncommon.