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Comments

flea

I am meeting with my counselor next week to talk about the issue of what I am passionate about. I have a job, am in school taking steps to a (second) career, and have 2 kids, and still am not passionate about, well, anything. I never have been. For me, motherhood hasn't changed this, though it has significantly lessened my time to wallow in worrying about it. My older child is 4 and my younger 20 months, so I'm still head-down and moving forward as best I can. No room for big picture, "what do I want in life?" worries. Except with some coming changes in our family, I NEED to think about what I want, so I can start advocating for it. Hence the counselor.

Heather

I definitely related to the comment about motherhood galvanizing me. I too was leading a busy and "productive" life before kids, but looking back, realize that I was scattered and really not pursuing anything that I was passionate about. Having a child changed all that, and boy, is it disconcerting! Now I am completely uninterested in my career and that terrifies me. I am much more focused now on new and different priorities but am still in the midst of the minute-by-minute infant/toddler years, so my children are my passion now. As an educated and career path woman, though, this loss of "direction", although it now seems to have been misdirection, is very hard to adjust to!!

Kate

Thanks! I'm going on vacation next week (without the kids or husband), and this is exactly the kind of book I am looking to bring! :-)

Rachel

I am definitely marking the Wolitzer as a to-read. It sounds very much like Rachel Cusk's Arlington Park, which I'm in the middle of so I can't absolutely recommend it, but it's quite similar--a look into one day in the lives of several English upper-middle-class SAHMs with small children. Unlike a lot of what's written along these lines, it's an honest, well-written exploration, not strident or shallowly characterized.

As to finding something to be passionate about--I think about this everyday. Years before having a baby, I structured my whole life around eventually being home with my kids--I worked full time from home as a freelance editor so that when I had children I'd be able to be home and still bring income into the house. Editing is not fulfilling or stimulating in the least, but it's expedient, it lets me be home with my daughter. So I'm a mother and a wife and an editor--but where is the piece that's mine, that I'll draw on when the kids are in school? I think we are all asking ourselves that, in one way or another.

And no, I don't think there has to be one specific thing that we're passionate about. I think you can be passionate about life in general, just immerse yourself in it and take joy in it. I think if you go about your small life with joy, and raise happy children who love you, and touch other people's lives in small ways, and are happy in the everyday, you will have lived a good life, even if you never find your True Calling or your Driving Passion. At least, I am hoping, cuz that's about where I am right now.

Claudia

Hrm. I am doing a job I love finally (teaching adults English at their workplace), but came into it very much by accident, and was blown away by how I love teaching. I was also coming from a long maternity leave, and had just started back to a job I hated, so it was very refreshing to be intellectually challenged and have an outlet for my need to a) speak English with someone besides my husband -- I live in Denmark -- and b) be the expert at something, since boy howdy do I feel like I am trying to keep no more than 3 steps behind my daughter's needs. I don't imagine that I'll be in pace with her, ha!

So I guess I got lucky, but maybe I wouldn't have taken to it quite so eagerly if I hadn't been in those circumstances.

I was 39 when I first started teaching, and hadn't had a passion before that. It was definitely an irritant, and who knows if I'll still be passionate about teaching after a few years. But I enjoy change, too, so maybe this is a stepping stone to something else.

michaela

So glad you reviewed this -- I heard a bit of the author's interview on Fresh Air and thought the book sounded really interesting.

As for me, my work (writing and editing, as well as teaching) really is a big part of my passion. But since my work situation has changed a bit -- I'm a freelancer now, rather than on staff at a publication -- I can actively advocate for issues that are important to me without crossing any ethical lines. So I have been *thrilled* to go back to my activist roots (tempered with some grownup sense) and do volunteer work related to women's economic security. I recently lobbied one of our senators (well, one of her staffers, anyway) about pay discrimination legislation, and just last night moderated a seminar on personal finance for women in their 20s and 30s.

I am incredibly, incredibly busy, and sometimes I feel guilty about that -- why can't I sit still? But a good friend mentioned recently that she is learning to distinguish between busy-ness that feeds her, and that which diminishes her. I've found that to be a really useful measure... and right now I'm definitely feeding my soul. Sure, I would like some more sleep, but this stuff is really fun -- and given that I'm raising a daughter, really relevant, too.

m

My boys are six weeks and two years (today!) so I'm not sure if I'm allowed to answer this, but I know that my passion for writing has faded. I'm hoping that this is just because I've got a toddler and a newborn and that when they get a bit older, my passion will return. But I don't know.

I know I have felt tonnes of guilt about not wanting to write anymore, and feel like a failure and a loser because of it. This has become worse since I have recently just finished reading the Margaret Laurence biography (important Canadian novelist). She had two young kids and did anything and everything possible to write, including getting up at 5 am (ha! can't imagine!) and writing any possible moment during the day. I just don't have that passion, that dedication, so it makes me think that I shouldn't be a writer, that I don't care enough. But, on the other hand, she left her husband, ignored her children, and became an alcoholic, so maybe I don't want that passion.


michaela

Oh, and I wanted to say that in a funny way motherhood gave me the courage to quit my job and freelance full-time. It sounds really counterintuitive (and I am blessed both with a husband who has a good salary and benefits and a freelance client who guarantees me regular work)... but given that I found parenting *so* hard, I really didn't want to stay in a job I didn't like. If I'm gonna be away from my kid, I need the work to be really satisfying. I count myself *very* lucky to be able to make that combination work.

Slim

As a devotee of Bravo competitive reality shows, I tend to roll my eyes when someone talks about passion, which seems to have become the buzzword that proves you deserve to exist. I sort of expect a You Bet Your Life moment whenever someone mentions passsion: Congratulations! You're our winner! and judgmental old me often thinks, "Well, but isn't that kind of a stupid thing to be passionate about?"

And then, while realizing I may not be passionate about my career, I have a very attractive moment of smugness that at least I'm not passionate about something superficial.

hydrogeek

I've actually decided that my life would be easier if I were NOT passionate about my work. Then I would feel perfectly comfortable finding something that were more compatible with motherhood, and all the time I want to spend with my daughter. I don't think I could ever be a full time SAHM, but I could sure find something part-time that would be "good enough" and stay with her the rest of the time if I didn't love my job so much. Maybe the bigger problem is that there is no way to leave this job and come back. There has to be someone here, full time, to do my duties. I don't know. How do you deal with competing passions? Having a child split me in two. Thank God it's gotten a bit easier as she's gotten older.

hedra

Rachel's got my vote... passionate about life. About relationships, feelings... those are my underlying passions.

I'm stuck for what was a change from parenthood in particular, though - I did a lot of healing and recovery work right around when G was born, so it's hard to spot what exactly was parenthood, and what was becoming whole.

I have more passions than I can manage, in the typical sense, as well. Parenthood, education, health, social services, medicine, gardening, art, writing... and within each, probably a half-dozen sub-passions. And each of those at different levels of intensity, with different cycles of growth and rest.

Some of my passions are definitely the daffodil sort - nothing-nothing-RIOT-OF-COLOR-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing. "Wow, where did THAT come from?" basically, followed by... "um, wasn't there something growing there? Where'd it go?" (only to show up again at some later point).

And others are more like wild ginger - hum-de-do, just some leaves here, hanging out, flowers color of dirt and covered by the leaves, and ... hey, look, that patch is taking over that corner of the yard, jeez, how long ago did I plant that? Years? Huh. Basically, 'I didn't even remember that was THERE, and look at it now.' Not flashy, but always present and gradually expanding.

I don't know if my focus is better or worse than before - I am always haring off in different directions (ENFP-style, 'look, a bird!'), but now some of those paths have enough wear that I can see that there are some directions I tend toward, and others that I don't. Focus was never my strong suit, regardless. And it's been over 10 years, I don't remember enough to compare before-kids to now.

@flea, I have a friend who had so little passion that she felt like she was just following along the paths she found herself on accidentally. She did some kind of test/counseling work with it, and found that she DID have some passions, after all, but that she'd never realized they counted. They were little fragmentary bits involved in everything she enjoyed, and only when they were all put together by an outside party could she see that there WAS something there, it was not a career or a field or an ideal, but it WAS something she could use to evaluate her choices to find what she'd enjoy most. I can't remember what it was, for her, but it was something like 'solving problems' or 'working in groups'. Maybe both. Anyway, good luck with that, I hope it's useful - it was very very useful to my friend, because she realized that the reason she'd never felt a huge drive to any one thing was that almost EVERY aspect of life had some of what she needed in it. Once she knew what to look for, she could shift directions just slightly and end up more satisfied, but it wasn't like she needed a SPECIFIC career in which to thrive. 90% of them would have worked, she just needed a certain kind of method of working, workplace arrangement, and company culture. I thought it was kind of cool.

rudyinparis

I think Rachel gets it right, too. What she wrote made me think of the late great author, Laurie Colwin. Her novels can all be, to some extent, described as "about fairly healthy and happy people who end up at the end being a little more healthy, and a little happier." And she manages to do this without being insipid, which is pretty difficult, when you think of it, to have a novel/s without some underlying trauma driving the narrative. She also was a mother, and a wonderful food writer and I think a great example of someone who knew how to be passionate about the world around her in a wonderful and gentle way.

And ditto Portnoy's Complaint. I read that in high school and was a little freaked out by it. Have never, never understood its status as a Revered Contemporary Classic.

hedra

@slim, I agree it's gone buzzword (to verb a noun, there). It's the new 'prove your worth' thing.

One of my sisters would be with you on that as well - she's just into living, but she sure doesn't have a death-grip on living, either - it's life, she shows up, she muddles through, she repeats it again tomorrow. Even parenthood isn't necessarily a 'passion' for her. She loves her kids, she wants the best for them, but it isn't lit up in neon and she doesn't feel she has to prove it to anyone in any particular way. She's sometimes somewhat puzzled by her lack of issue with it, but she's also very easy with it - it makes her laugh.

She has things she cares about but passion? Nah. That's for other people. People with money, big cars, and goals that can be checked off like a list when you retire. She's more interested in being herself, making choices that work for her family, and figuring out how to muddle through whatever phase her kids are in now. There's no accounting, just another day done and time to rest. Problems solved or problems yet to be solved, it's greeted with a smile and a one-shoulder shrug. Whatever, really, the people she loves know that they're loved - that's how she measures her value in the world, why should she need more?

It's kind of hard to argue with. And I agree with hydrogeek, things are easier when we're not pulled violently in multiple directions. That's always been part of my nature, so I'm used to it, but ... not a simple way to live.

Rachel

How timely! I technically shouldn't be answering this since my youngest still wakes up once a night but it has been on my mind a lot lately. One day last week my husband came out of his office and casually asked how my day was going. I burst into tears and babbled something about my brain being made for more than "this" ("this" being endless refereeing of fights, 3 year old attitude, wiping up spills ALL DAY LONG and not being able to do much outside b/c of the stupid, endless snow and a baby who freaks in the slightest breeze)!

Truly, I love being home with my kids but I feel like my brain is turning a tad mushy. It scares me to think about what I am going to do once we are out of the chaotic stage of life. I used to be really focused and have specific goals but that has changed since I had kids. I was 3/4 of the way through my MA in Marriage and Family Therapy when our oldest was born. Now I feel like my focus has totally changed and I don't want to pursue that direction anymore. The thing is, I'm not sure what direction I want to go in. I know that anything is possible but not all paths are realistic. When I get discouraged I try to remember that I am still young and that I have a lot of time to pursue my "passion". For me, that likely won't be a full time career. I just want to do something that makes a difference in people's lives outside of our family.

This is a little babbly so I'll end with saying thanks for the book review. I will look forward to reading it.

Arwen

I can't say motherhood has focused me because my 17-month-old daughter *is* still waking up multiple times a night, so I am noticeably... unfocused.

However, I will say that motherhood has CENTERED me. It is certainly a passion for me, which is why I'm happier and more at peace as a SAHM than I've ever been before, even though I spend a large part of the day picking up crayons and trying to get my daughter to eat something besides yogurt and bananas. Incidentally, I wasn't sure that motherhood would be my passion but always suspected it, which made our infertility doubly hard for me.

Melanie

Passion? Well, I got into scrapbooking when my oldest was 1. Then went digital soon after my second one was born - and pregnant with third - I am taking online painting classes and trying to keep an art journal. I am a scientist in my 'real' job and need outlets. But I find I am constantly in a tug of war with myself - after work, I want down time - but I have a 4 year old and 2 year old who needs me. So I try to focus on them - but I get so distracted - end up picking up a magazine (that is after supper is cooked and cleared and baths are given) while they are running crazy (they are both boys). After I put them to bed, I try and do my 'artsty' stuff like paint or scrapbook or read ... whatever. But I feel guilty. I am almost always trying to find a way to 'get away' to do something else. That is not fair to the boys ... but I resent what I can't do for ME now. Oh, man, this is turned into a different post than I wanted ... Sorry - but does anyone else ever feel that way? Or how can I deal with it?

Amy

My daughter is 18 months old, and I am just now coming out of the daze of that first year, starting to ache a little bit for ways to feed my spirit. I've been having a gigantic internal discussion with myself about it (in addition to bending the ears of my mother and husband).

I agree with Hydrogeek, I found that motherhood diminished some of my passions - I am so enraptured with my daughter and feel so humbled and responsible and excited by mothering her, a lot of the "just for me" stuff faded in importance. My career has DEFINITELY been back-burnered, or maybe stalled altogether. I just don't care about it that much anymore. I would love to do something part-time, generally satisfying, and be able to be with my child (and with myself! doing self thing!) the rest of the time. Working full time sucks the life out of me.

I crave some new food for my soul ... some means of finding balance ... I want so much to engage in my life, rather than going through the same. motions. every. day. I feel like I am doing my daughter a disservice, being this person who rushes through every hour just trying to keep up. I want her to understand how to stop and smell the roses, how to pause and really look, how to take time to listen to herself.

These are the things I miss doing for myself, from before motherhood. REALLY reading a book (like, reading a complex sentence over and over again until the meaning explodes into clarity); creative endeavors that require long concentration (read: meditative crafting!); being able to nurture a complicated, day-long recipe into a gorgeous meal.

hedra

m, my desire to write came back later. It just went dormant (okay, somewhat - I'm complusive about writing, and I write for work, but the desire to write books, that just faded out... and is rising again now that the girls are 3 1/2).

Melanie, I think I have a diagnosis for ya: you have a 2 year old. Because I have felt that way every time I've had a 2 year old, for every one of them. From there to about 3 and a bit, I grit my teeth and want time to do things *I* want to do, dammit! It's a transitional point, it gets better as you ease out the other side. (mainly because they start giving you time for you as they get older - I remember when the girls were just over 3, I was sitting at the dinner table and I looked up at DH, he looked at me, and we realized we'd been sitting there for a WHOLE FIFTEEN MINUTES without someone needing a blessed thing from us! HOLY COW! It's gotten better from there. Grit your teeth and hold on, it will come!)

Cloud

@Michaela, I totally agree with you that if I'm going to be away from Pumpkin it has to be for a job I enjoy. But I'll admit I'm not passionate about my work they way some of the folks I went to grad school with are- it was clear to me even then that I'm not a passionate scientist. I'm trained as a scientist. I enjoy science, and recently changed from a job with 35 hours/week to a regular 40 hour/week job in part so that I could think about science more, but I'm not passionate- I still go home on time and can easily stop thinking about work things and focus on other things at night. I've always been this way- I think of my job as something that pays for some of the other things that make my life as a whole meaningful- like travel. I also really enjoy being able to give chunks of money to charities whose missions I support. I figure someone has to make the money that those passionate people need. I'm a bit more passionate about living a greener lifestyle, but even that I can't claim to be truly passionate about. We try to consider the environmental impact of all of our decisions, but that is not the only thing we consider.

So I guess to me, its not about being passionate about ONE THING. It is about crafting a life that feels right to me, and that contains work, travel, family, and community (in the broadest sense).

Jo-Ann

WOW. Yeah I had a passion that is no longer relevant now that I have kids. (My boys are 2 and 4). Before I had kids I spent 10 years in a punk rock band. We were signed and did alot of traveling. We would try to do 2 - 80 date tours a year. I was the lead singer and did all of our management. I would book our tours with the help of a publicist and a few booking agent friends. My life was the band. Writing songs, rehearsals, shows, touring, management stuff. It was a full time job and being on stage made my hair stand on end and is the best feeling ever.
I married the guitarist and now we have a couple kids and we are over 40. My life is so different. I have not had time to mourn it lately but it is just like I blinked my eyes and I have 2 kids and I'm trying to swim upstream. I know I eventually have to find a new passion. Punk rock is a young woman's game. The new passion is eluding me. I am too bogged down in food allergies and ADHD diagnosis to even consider it. I am seeing a light at the end of the tunnel. My youngest starts preschool this year and the world is going to be my oyster for 6 whole hours a week.

paola

I am not passionate about any one thing, but I am truly happy for the first time in my life. I recently thought, this is the most I have ever lived in one place, one house since I was 21 (20 years ago). I have never had a job longer than 4 years either, or lived in one country for more than 3 years for that matter till now.

I realise I was constantly looking for something that I could never find, or that perhaps didn't exist, something complicated. Instead it couldn't have been simpler. I found it with my present life. I have a wonderful life, 2 beautiful healthy children and a great husband, who I totally take for granted ( poor guy). My former 21 year old self would never recognise me in this role, although I do think it was something that was in me back then too.

Bella

It's downright uncanny how some of your posts are perfectly timed with my concerns.

This is THE issue for me. I haven't been labeling it "passion", more like "meaning", "drive" or just plain "interest." I was infertile for 5 years and was convinced that the reason I no longer felt the same drive or passion for my work (developmental psychologist) was that I was so emotionally focused on having children. Then I had my fabulous twin boys and fell in love with them (a year later... it took a while, what with all that crazy twin mothering/breastfeeding/guilt ,etc.). Now they're two, and I love them to pieces. They are pure joy... but guess what? Having gone back to work full time after the first year, I still feel that ephemeral "emptiness." Something's missing. I'm not as turned on as I was in grad school, during my post-doctoral position, during times when I was intellectually stimulated and stimulating. I am shocked, but children didn't fill that gap.

And now I'm struggling to find what WILL fill that gap. And I'm not looking for Nobel Prize-level stuff. Just something that will pull my attention and heart into a purpose that feels "right." Csikszentmihalyi calls it "flow", others have found it in yoga, meditation, skiing, writing. I don't know where I'll find it, but I know I have to start looking for it in earnest.

And I feel this need to find "it" even more so now that I have kids. Because if I'm going to be away from them 8 hours/day, it better be for a damn good reason.

Jan

I am starting to suspect that 'finding your passion' is sort of like 'finding your soul mate'. It's at best an unrealistic expectation and at worst a pipe dream that keeps us from appreciating what's right in front of us.

Let's face it. Life is complicated. And ever-changing. Is it really reasonable to expect some one activity or goal or dream to satisfy the complex moving target that is our mental, physical and emotional need? I think the best we can hope for his something that speaks to us most of the time, and that has reasonable flexibility to allow us to stretch in different directions as our needs change.

Maybe this is something of a 'sour grapes' response, since I've never found that one thing that grabs hold of me and completes me. It hasn't been for lack of trying either. You wouldn't believe the laundry list of jobs/careers I've tried out!

I think motherhood had allowed me to change my priorities and focus. I've made a conscious choice to work less and, honestly, I probably do so probably with less intensity and efficiency than I could.

I'm on an interesting road right now with respect to some of this. I'd love to be home with my kids more (plus I'd like to have one more and the idea of going into infant-mommy-hood without the specter of gotta-go-back-to-work hanging over my head makes me fairly swoon with anticipation) but I'm also finding that I've experienced a shift over the last five years. (Whether that's due to becoming a mother or just getting older, I don't know) I think I'm seeing a side of myself that I've somewhat denied. I am enjoying being creative, even artsy. I'm beginning to learn to write, and I'm finding real satisfaction in imagining and creating things with my hands. This is a pretty big shift from software engineering!

Well THAT was a total aside. I guess what I think is that I have changed. I think becoming a mom is responsible for part of that, but approaching 40 and beginning to really realize that these years of my life are all I'm going to get has contributed to. And a part of that change has been realizing that there probably is never going to be one holy grail 'thing' that will magically make me happy. I have to learn to carve out happiness in the life I have.

JB

I'm a WOHM because teaching is my passion. I love it, adore it, it energizes me. Dealing with my kids, whom I also adore, tires me out! (I have a 3-year-old and a 6-month-old.) I loved my maternity leave, but I was happy to get back to work, and while I had whispers of guilt, I mostly felt wonderful about getting all this in my life at once.

My husband has a job he is good at but drifted into. He's not passionate about it and can't think of a profession he would be passionate about. In the past, I've wanted that for him because it's so rewarding to me, but now I think he is complete with his many creative hobbies (music, woodworking, writing, baking) and being a dad. Not everyone has to have some force that drives them. Some people just drive themselves, because they want to see what's along the road.

JB

p.s. @rudyinparis -- I love Laurie Colwin. LOVE. I read her books slowly, slowly, because I know she died and I won't have any more to read after these!

Parisienne Mais Presque

Man, does this discussion come at the right time.

I just came back from the first adaptation session with our child care provider. My son is almost nine months old, and I'll be going back to work in two weeks.

To say that I'm ambivalent about it all is an understatement. For the first time since the emotionally-overwhelmed-by-a-newborn stage I found myself unable to keep from melting into tears after I left.

I never found my job that fulfilling, but I'm beginning to feel like perhaps I need the balance of Something Else in my life. But the idea of leaving this little guy that I'm so bonded with now just tears me apart...

...and then I start thinking about the two years, three years, five years down the road when he won't need me so intensely, is this what I'd planned, what I wanted?

I think the next few weeks (month? months?) are going to be rough for me.

I'll perhaps have to pick up this book when I slog back to my commute in the Metro.

ML

Hey m! I always felt rather ambivalent about Margaret Laurence and I always suspected she neglected her kids a little, just like most female artists who were very focused on their work. Which is not to say you can't be a great artist and be there for your kids--or at least, that's what I'm hoping. When I was an English Lit undergrad, I thought I wanted to be a writer, but discovered really didn't have a passion or self-discipline to do it. Writing became a soul-annihilating chore. Adrift, I found graphic design, which allowed to to combine words and pictures, two things I really enjoyed. Fast forward a few years, a husband and a 14-month-old later, I work as a graphic designer. 70% (mostly more) of it is "just work" and 30% (often less) is enjoyable and creative. Is this a good proportion (rhetorical question)? I used to think I'd work freelance at home once I had kids, but I hated the aggressiveness of always having to find clients and work, so I work in-house, where there are benefits and a managable work-life balance. I've also long given up on the idea that my career should fulfill me, so I've tried to do the things that I loved in art school (drawing, painting, other creative projects) but The Little Boy is oh-so-little and needs me so intensely, every minute he's awake that I have very little energy left over for "passions". I too feel bad that I've lost the "passion" for my hobbies, that I'll never be good at drawing because I never practice. Who knows whether this will change or we'll have another baby or what? Are having "passion(s)" a bourgeois luxury? On the other hand, the most depressing piece of advice ever given to me was from my Chinese immigrant mother: "Everyone hates their job. You just get used to it."

Moxie

ML--One of the characters in the book is Chinese-American, and her Chinese immigrant mother tells her almost exactly the same thing!

DW

I agree with some others about not really having a passion. And I don't think I necessarily need one. I have always been a bit jealous of folks who are completely driven by something they love (art, for instance). But you know what? I don't WANT to be "driven" by anything. I like just living.

Currently I work 3 days/week. I've never loved my job. But I do like it, and I have a great employer. I feel I really need those 3 days to go and be around people who don't talk about diapers and sleep schedules. And I get a lot out of the precision and definitiveness (is that a word?) of my work (accounting). It's predictable and reliable in a way that motherhood isn't.

I love my daughter immensely. But having her hasn't really consumed me or galvanized me. I don't feel I'm a bad mom for this. But motherhood is not all there is in my life. In fact, I'm pretty sure I'm a better mother to her for working outside the home. The days we do have together I have more energy to attend to her needs.

I've always been good at taking time for myself. The 14 months since L was born, I've done more running and achieved personal records, etc. I've also rededicated myself to my yoga practice. Of course, I couldn't do these things w/o a very supportive husband. But again, I think they make me a better mom. If I didn't have a few hours per week of alone time (in running or yoga), I might lose my sanity. Hmm...maybe I do have passions!

Great topic, Moxie. Thanks.

DW

Oh, and I only meant I'm a better mother for working out of the home in that it keeps me sane. It's certainly not a criticism of any one else's decision. It's simply what is necessary for me.

pnuts mama

since the pnut is not even three yet i don't have the perspective many of you with older kids have on all this, but i'm really connecting with what so many of you have written i suppose i'll try to work this out. i'm passionate about my kid and my family to be sure- and i get a great deal of satisfaction to go along with the normal blahs of day-to-day being a SAHM. but i also have things that are truly my own to be passionate about, my problem is making the time to devote to them.

i would say that as a younger person my passion always revolved around the creative arts (for my husband, as well) but the reality of trying to work in a field that would support me was soul-crushing. for me, making a living from art (in my case, graphic design) removed what was always so fulfilling about it. and when you leave the luxury of having unlimited time in a state of the art photo lab facility after graduation, well, slr photography is another thing that slowly slips away from you.

i went back to graduate school in a field i'd never considered until i started doing volunteer work in it about 6 years ago, and that is what i'd consider my current passion to be sure. i love being able to sit with my peers in my field and exercise the part of my brain that often gets left to atrophy as a mama- my dissertation topic is absolutely my passion, unfortunately it gets shifted to the backburner too often! finishing it will, i hope, help me to do good work as i live out my vocation. i know, vocation is a religious term, but that is how i define if i am living what i am meant to be doing, on any level- parent, caretaker, student, teacher, paid, unpaid.

that's what this whole discussion brought out for me, different parts of my whole being fulfilled in different yet necessary ways- none being 'better' or 'more important' (and allowing for them to develop or change), but each valid in their own ways for various reasons. not choosing one thing over another but finding a way to balance to keep making progress as a person. not necessarily doing one 'big' thing, but doing a multitude of small-medium-big things for the reasons you are called to do them.

Amy

I'll tell you what, I used to be passionate about a lot of things: my historical research (as part of my job as a college prof), my children (once I became a mother), creating the perfect family (until I got a divorce). Now, honestly, I find that I can't muster the energy to be passionate about any of those things (and, okay, I'm not even supposed to answer this as #3 is only 10 mos. and still wakes at night). I don't even attempt the research anymore because I fear I'll be interrupted by some other aspect of my life; I fear that I am failing my children because I don't have the time or energy to give them the attention they want/need; and well, the perfect family... who ever heard of a perfect "step" family?? (I'm being facetious here.) I want desperately to be passionate again about all of those things. But I can't dig down deep enough to find the will. I feel like I skate by each day doing the bare minimum at my job, with my kids, and with my marriage.

Man, when I write this I sound so pitiful. But my "bare minimum" existence has really been on my mind lately.

m

@hedra - glad to hear that the writing passion came back for you. There's hope for me! Even though, I don't think it has ever been a Passion in the ways it has been for some folks I know. It's a strange thing I've been trying to figure out lately.

@ML - I've never been super hot on Margaret Laurence, either, but a writing/mom friend of mine suggested the bio, saying it inspired her. I read it horrified. I think I need to read a bio of Carol Shields or someone like that--stable, long marriage, four kids, very successful (GG & Pulitzer), normal, happy life. But no one will probably write that bio, because where's the drama in that? Happiness doesn't make for a good story.

It's true what your mom says. Even my husband who is able to make a living as a theatre artist often works without passion. Work is work. It often sucks, even if it is your passion.

MrsHaley

ITA with Moxie (motherhood has galvanized & focused me), Arwen (I am happier and more centered as a mother than I ever was as a career person), Rachel (a small life with small joys filled with love), Heather (my children are my passion rather than my former career -- surprise!) and Paola (amazed at this wonderful life we've built) ...

Approaching motherhood, family and home with the same work ethic and attention to detail I took with my job has really helped me focus on my current role as equally contributive, valuable and consuming (as if it could be anything but) as WOTH was. This was kind of surprising to me!

Lisa

I'm feeling both lucky and frustrated reading these comments. Lucky, because I've had one passion - reading and writing (and specifically, writing poetry) for my whole life, though it took me until I was 28 to shelve a life of satisfying-others-so-they'll-stop-bugging-me and start actually living the life that I wanted, including taking writing seriously. Now I have a two-year-old son and a second passion: being a mother to him.

God, that sounds so clichéd... and yet I always knew that I wanted to write and have a kid. Everything else, including marriage, was negotiable. And I spent 10 years, from 28 to 38, making choices - working as a freelance editor, marrying a man who "gets" me as a creative person because he's one himself - that supported both these things.

I also went into parenthood at the late-ish age of 38, knowing that, combined with a late-ish start at writing seriously, it would have a big effect on my writing "career." (Poets don't get to use that word without air quotes.) And yeah, I've written and published very little in the last two years. (Other writing moms tell me that if you write *at all* in the first 3 years, you're doing OK; I've chosen to believe them.) I'm still a writer.

But being a mother has not just galvanized me - it's a crucible. I know what's important: my son, my husband, my writing. In that order. Everything else is way down the list. So much else has fallen away as ash, and though I'm starting to get bits of it back, I'm more ruthless than I used to be, and less apologetic. My day job is just that - I phone it in at a very high level, with the express goal of maximum money in minimum time. I think this is a good thing.

As for writing being #3: I am so sick of the idea that to be a serious artist, one must put art before everything, including family. It's so... male. My devotion to my husband and son does not make me less serious; it makes me an adult.

Lisa

Oh, the "frustrated" part.

I do have a lot of frustration - first, at the ridiculous male-centered ideas of what having a creative passion looks like and should mean for one's life - and second, at how hard it is for any of us, men or women, to carve out a life in contemporary American culture with space for any kind of passion at all. For all the above, some weeks I can barely get past the demands of making enough money and keeping child and house together. I know that's a victory of sorts as well... but it's a lot harder to feel good about it.

hedra

Lisa, I love you! :) YES! I was just saying to someone... dang, who? ... that I know a woman who wrote some really great stuff when her kids were little, and they resented her into their teens for it, because the passion consumed space they felt was theirs by right and by love. She doesn't regret doing it, but she did have to work with her kids to recover from it. I decided I couldn't do that. I can do a bit, but I can't really put them aside and drive myself into the writing (or have it pull me in)... and I've had to reconcile the fact that I CHOOSE my path, and that means the book's gonna be delayed, dammit, the kids and the DH come first. It *felt* like a grownup decision, but I wasn't sure if it was just a dodge or something... I like that someone else says that it is what I thought, just being an adult, and making a choice with both rationality and love.

So, thanks. :)

hedra

(And as I'm considering a possible full-time gig with the hopes of better benefits, even if less flexibility... um, yeah. Sometimes the 'success' is more of a trade-off or marking time until some later point. It can't be harvest season all year long, sometimes it's winter and we're just huddling using up all our stored reserves...)

Lisa

Can you tell that I feel strongly about this thicket of issues? :->

I have a question for all of you: How does having one child vs. several affect all of this?

I'm leaning toward one only these days, for both practical and less-tangible reasons. I'm not sure I could say the above with as much conviction if another child, and the time and financial and relationship pressure that entails, entered our lives. I think I fear too many aspects of my self getting lost.

m

@Lisa, I don't think putting art above everything else is male, but I do think it is a cliche that we, as a culture, holds on to. It's even better if the artist is a drunk. And poor. And tortured.

We keep hearing about it because it makes a great story. We don't tell the stories of happy, stable, family-focused, successful artists because it's not that interesting (where's the conflict? the rising action? the reversals?). It's too bad, because right now, I really need to hear those stories!

Charisse

@hedra, thank you so much for that benchmark on writing! I've felt like a schmuck so many times since Mouse was born, because I am really only now beginning to be able to seriously work on (never mind finish yet) poems. She's about to be 4 and it's just seemed possible recently--my website still has 2003 stuff because that's the latest. I really have kicked myself over and over about this, especially because I was just starting to get published before I got pregnant, and it's such a big step from there to regularly published. And I've known I hadn't lost the passion, I just could. not. do it. Thank you.

My passions haven't changed much since becoming a mother, except for the addition one little girl to them!! But I think it's brought me greater freedom to prune, to skip stuff I don't care about, etc. I also got laid off when Mouse was nearly 2 and had the opportunity (because of a severance package) to take my time and find paid work that could be a passion as well as a reasonably pleasant and financially good thing. That's made a big difference.

And just, humility. I remember so many times in my 20s having serious conversations with one of my favorite yoga teachers, who's about my age, about the need to "find opportunities to practice humility" as if it was some kind of choice. Man, if you are a parent, humility is not really something you need to look too hard for. It's right there waiting to be lived and accepted. I haven't lost my passion for practice, but now by necessity it's a passion that must wait, must be caught as I can, must support the rest of my life instead of being an independent purpose. I still hurt for the intensity I remember (and may yet go back to a decade hence) but it's more real now. Everything is more real.

Parisienne Mais Presque

Just to add that we'll see how it goes when I am back at work, but I agree with so many others that parenthood has focused me.

It has settled in over the months since he was born. Now I finally get what's important and what's not. Big stuff like family relationships. Small stuff like obsessing about housekeeping or planning the perfect vacation. I suspect that this clarity will spill into my professional life as well...

...and I may just find that this job that I did not miss much over all these months may just not be worth it, after all.

Or, I may just find that I'm exceptionally efficient for once, that I get in to the office, get my job done, and then get out to live the rest of my life.

It is just so darn comforting to keep repeating to yourself "one of these days, I'll just give this all up and do this instead..." without ever acting on it.

Lisa

Ah, Hedra - I know what you're saying. We live in a hugely expensive city on one and a quarter incomes (decent ones, but still - that quarter-income is crucial). My DH, an immensely talented writer, works a boring day job for the benefits; someone has to. You do what you need to, and - if that original passion/desire/whatever still exists, you keep writing, no matter how slowly. You win by keeping going. And your children get to see you be both a mother and a writer, working to make it work.

hedra

@Lisa, well, we have four kids. It definitely delays it, but it's like the last one is the first one, for the energy.

Some stuff will change just from time and age.

Some stuff will be more complicated due to more schedules and less money.

But it still works. My mom had seven kids, and, well, by the time the youngest was 3 or 4, she was writing poetry, back in book groups, gourmet club, hiking... AND getting a degree. The gap was a long one - that 10 year nap thing, I guess. But the gap was also limited by the age of the youngest child more than anything else.

I recently started reading through some of the stuff I wrote in the 'gaps' - a lot before G, some between G and B, a little bit between B and M+R, and a good lump with the help of a mother's helper when I was laid off when M+R were little... I'm a better writer for the gap. I see different things. I have distance on my previous narratives, I can see where I was self-indulgent, ego-based, arrogant. Reading my old stuff, I sometimes am forced to do the 'gagging myself with a spoon' gesture because it's so mortifying to read what crap I thought was good.

So, the extra kids, extra time, also can be good. I don't think there's one recipe or one path - no way to know if it will derail you or set you up better. Which means choose the next child if you want another child, not out of fear that it will mangle your life path. Your life path will make or unmake itself, if you have the child because you want to have the child. You can't choose to go forward assuming either outcome to the exclusion of the alternate. Too many variables.

pnuts mama

@ amy- i think you really hit the nail on the head with what so many of us feel everyday- survival as the ultimate goal, no real feelings of progress or accomplishment, at least not in the ways that we were able to define it pre-children, because parenting is such a fluid, amorphous process.

i often compare all of my responsibilities with the circus act of the person trying to keep ten plates spinning simultaneously- or, when i'm just feeling all around crappy, i think all i'm doing is half-assing everything and everyone is getting the short-end, including me. and it is hard to get out of that funk of a self-fulfilling prophecy. those are my lowered expectation, survive at any means necessary days to be certain.

i have found that in hindsight a lot of those feelings are cyclical- "winters to slog through" (as hedra puts it), storing up the reserves for the upswing on a cycle when less is being expected of me in whichever area and i can devote my time/energy better to each area, learning what i can from the process to help me address whatever current fire is flaring up in front of me to be taken care of.

hang in there- i believe somewhere in the archives here is a line that says "it will get better, then worse, then better, then worse again, then better again" -i hope for you it gets better soon.

pnuts mama

oh hedra, that comment about being better for the gaps was a real eye-opener for me- wow, i hadn't thought about it that way. you know, i read stuff i wrote pre-pnut and while the content/research/writing is good, the tone and imagery is so awful now in hindsight- so whiny and self-indulgent and narcissistic- my advisor has been telling me recently that he feels as though i am finally finding my voice now, and i can't honestly say that i made any connection between my mama-self and my academia-self til just now. wow, really.

lisa- deciding to have #2 at this stage of our game (and my dissertation process, which of course in my head was going to be all wrapped up by the end of this semester-ahaha) was HUGE for us- much greater than when we thought about the pnut. i imagine it of course has a lot to do with what we now understand the reality of having her means for our lives- the good and the bad, and especially the time. i think everyone tries their best to make the right decision for their family with what they have. but i totally get that thought of "will there be ANY of me left for me with another one?"

MrsHaley

@Lisa, LOVE the idea of parenthood being the crucible that burns away the excess. That's the truth, there.

@Hedra, also love the seasonal metaphor ... I know that is always true, but so hard to put a name to the winter-times of using the reserves, or even planting & cultivating, instead of reaping.

Also, somewhere in the archives someone said about the parenthood/work/passion balance that she felt it was important for her daughters to see her striving toward that, but ESSENTIAL for her sons to see it. SO TRUE in light of the masculine "passion paradigm" that places family behind passion.

Lisa

@Charisse, it's good to know you are starting to work on poems again - because you're really good, and because it gives me a glimpse a few years into the future - it will come back.

And I know what you mean about just not being able to do it when the kid is little. Ninety-eight percent of the last two years, the necessary deep-diving focus has just been too much for me, and not just because of the sleep deprivation.

Lisa

@Hedra and Pnuts mama:

You're right, of course. I think I just keep second-guessing myself. Barring a happy accident, I don't think we'd have another unless we start wanting one the way we wanted the first. For reasons outside the practical, mostly. And I suspect age-related pressure is making me a bit antsy about the issue - not a ton of time to decide.

And Hedra: I too think motherhood has made my work better and less ego-driven. What little I've done this year is a huge leap from the past. Part of me is dying to follow that thread deep and fast, and part is just not ready on a host of levels.

becky

Motherhood galvanized me. I was stuck before.

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  • My expertise is in helping people be who they want to be, with a specialty in how being a parent fits into everything else. I like people. I like parents. I think you're doing a fantastic job. The nitty-gritty of what you do with your kids is up to you, although I'm happy to post questions here to get data points of how you could try approaching different stages, because, let's face it, this shit is hard. As for me, I have two kids who sleep through the night and can tie their own shoes. I've been a married SAHM, a married freelance WAHM, a divorcing WOHM, a divorced WOHM, and now a WAHM again. I'm not buying the Mommy Wars and I'll come sit next to you no matter how you're feeding your kid. When in doubt, follow the money trail. And don't believe the hype.
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