Response to my cloth diapering posts

Remember my cloth diapering posts from way back when? I recently got this email from Laura:

"First, I just wanted to say how much I enjoy your blog, "Ask Moxie."  I am a mother of 3 kids, ages 6, 3, and 1, work part-time outside the home, and find your non-judgemental, common-sense parenting philosophy so refreshing.  It's a terrific resource, keep up the great work!

With that preface, I just wanted to comment that your entries (featured prominently on your sidebar) on diapering didn't sit well with me.  While you try to separate parenting choices from environmental choices in your opening paragraph, I don't think they are that divisible.  Making responsible environmental choices is part and parcel of what many people consider to be "good" mothering.  Preserving the earth for our children, fostering environmental stewardship in the next generation, etc.  And, generally, I feel like the tone of these entries is not in keeping with the "good-for-you" feel of the rest of your blog.

Aside from that general impression, I want to comment specifically on your hierarchy of environmental impact of diapering choices.  I work in the environmental field as a biologist and environmental educator, consider myself an environmentalist, and researched this issue extensively before my oldest child was born.  The issue is far from clear-cut, and certainly cannot be sorted into the kind of linear hierarchy you present.  I encourage you to take a look at the book "The Consumers Guide to Effective Environmental Choices" by Michael Brower and Warren Leon, published by the Union of Concerned Scientists.  It addresses cloth vs disposable diapering and how it is a non-issue in the whole scheme of things.  Now, you may feel completely free to disagree with their findings, but the point is that there is honest disagreement in the scientific community on this issue and it's oversimplified, even misrepresented on your blog.

Because the diapering issue is emotionally charged, and far from environmentally clear-cut, I would like to see your diapering entries edited to focus more on the wealth of information you have on how to do cloth diapering.  And to emphasize that diapering is just one more parenting choice that you make based on what feels right to you, for whatever reason.  If the environmental piece is truly a separate issue, as you assert, then why bring it in at all?  In my opinion, it is just a detriment to what would otherwise be a terrific entry on how to cloth diaper.

Thanks again for all the time you put in to this terrific parenting resource.  I hope it brings you as much pleasure as it does your myriad readers!"

Interesting thoughts.

I'd like to address the environmental choices being part of good parenting comment, and give some background on why I wrote the cloth diapering posts in the first place.

When I started cloth diapering my first son I quickly discovered that online it made me a saint. I was one of the good, chosen mothers who cared more about her child and about the environment than those evil, oblivious disposable-diapering mothers did.  Those mothers were to be pitied or scorned for their bad choices.

I really didn't  buy into that. For one thing, I diapered because it was cheaper and it was just as easy for me to wash a load of diapers as to schlep out and buy more. So how did being cheap and lazy make me better than someone who assiduously researched whether to use Pampers or Huggies or Seventh Generation?

And there was plenty of scorn from the disposable-diapering crowd online, who apparently thought all cloth diapering mothers were tree-hugging freaks who did everything the hard way because it made us feel good.

So my cloth diapering posts were meant primarily to introduce the different ways of cloth diapering to people who were curious about it, but also to dispel the myth that cloth diapering automatically makes you a better parent. There are so many reasons people use cloth diapers, and so many reasons people use disposable diapers (the entry costs to start using cloth diapers are way more than some excellent parents can manage, for example) that it makes no sense to me to make judgments about other people's parenting on the basis of choices about diapering.

I think that's why I wrote those first few paragraphs, including the one about the hierarchy of diapering choices, in such a brisk, flippant way. I didn't want people to start any one-upping or misery poker in the comments sections. Obviously this was before I knew everyone well enough to know you all were as committed to having a safe space to muse and analyze without having to be defensive and posturing.

So I guess my questions is this: Should I rewrite that post? Did you take it to mean that that was the absolute, essential hierarchy of good for the environment? What about someone who found this site through one of the cloth diapering posts? Also, let me know if I need to drop an even broader hint.

Comments

[anna]

We've been using G Diapers- which seem to make the most sense environmentally and are easier than cloth (and usually don't have as much contanct with dook). We use Seventh Generation when traveling or visiting people with older plumbing- but really recommend the G's wholeheartedly! And no diaper rash : )

[Susannah]

aaaaahhhhh.... Moxie.... should we just stop asking?

[kate Lancaster]

I think your posts are great as is. I just read them yeasterday. I think I may need to switch to cloth for my chubby thighed sensitive skinned 18 month old. Not sure which way to go still overwhelmed with the choices. Need something to contain the blowwouts we are experiencing lately as she begins to walk. Any great suggestions?? This site is great I read it allthe time and learn a lot.

[Maureen]

I'm not sure I understand what Laura is getting at, actually. Is her point that disposable and cloth diapers have equally bad environmental impacts? I have heard this argument, but I find it very hard to believe. It does sound like Laura is a expert on this and I am most definitely not, but I still find it hard to accept that throwing away all those diapers is just as bad as washing and reusing diapers, water and energy use notwithstanding.

Maybe Laura could expound on this and you could just add a link to this post in your CD posts.

For what it's worth, I found your CD posts hugely helpful, but mostly because of your explanations of how to wash them, not so much because of your introduction.

[Jamie W.]

Hi,
I'd been reading your blog for months before our daughter was born, and I found it through a search for "Cloth Diapers NYC". I thought the posts were terrific, and that you were just basically stating the pros and cons (environmentally and financially) of disposables vs. cloth.

I want to say that those cloth diapering posts helped me make choices on what cloth diapers to buy, since we'd be washing them in our apartment and hanging them to dry most of the time. They were very informative, the comments were helpful as well.

For me, it's environmental and financial. We've been using cloth for 4 months now (our DD was born very little, and we had to wait for her to get big enough to use them!) and it still makes me feel as though I care for the planet *and* our bank account.

[kelly]

I too found your CD posts very helpful as an introductory path through the maze of CD options. (I'm expecting my first next April, so all of this is quite new to me.) I did not take your introduction to mean a clear environmental hierarchy, and I appreciated your refusal to situate CD as some form of partenting martyrdom / heroism / beatification.

For me, and I suspect for many parents, the environmental aspect of CD is one part of the choice. Cost of setup, washing procedures (we live in an apartment, so washing is a big part of the debate), childcare situtation, and personal preference all come into play.

FWIW, I would like to hear more from Laura about the environmental pros and cons, and as Maureen suggested, perhaps that could be a link from your CD posts. I think your posts, though, are fine as they are.

[Moxie]

There's a big hint to the left of the page, but not anything sticky that would stay attached to any of the posts.

[m]

I found your site through cloth diapering. We started with a service but have since moved to a community that doesn't have a diaper service and am now washing our own.

Although some of the advice you gave actually didn't work with us (we have found that we need to presoak in buckets before doing a presoak in the wash), I loved the way you wrote and started to explore you blog just a bit more and now I'm hooked.

The reasons behind why we decided to CD are about split between environmental and my laziness (and our carless state). When we travel we use DD and while I have heard that it is equal, I still feel sick about thowing them out. Perhaps it's just psychological.

As for rewriting your posts, I don't think you need to, but then I'm on the CD "side". Because I am lazy and you claim to be, I know I wouldn't want to rewrite them. I'd just add the link to this post to the sidebar instead.

[Dawn]

i think how you wrote it was fine. But then, it may be that I agree with you and so of course I think it's fine - someone who disagrees .... eh, I can't speak for them.

[Leah]

I wish the the cloth v. disposable debate was actually less about the environment. Mainly because I hate that people treat me like a martyr for doing cloth, when I do it because it is easier than shlepping boxes of diapers, I LIKE the cute cloth ones better the disposables, and they WORK better for me (no poop blowouts up the back). I wish cloth were more normal. But I also wish people didn't get on their environmental high horse about a lot of other things, too, so I guess I'm just a weirdo for CDing not for environmental reasons.

Also, as someone who is probably not going to read the book mentioned, I'm just totally unclear on how that works. How can it be better to manufacture things over and over than to manufacture something once and reuse it? Isn't that a part of the environmental canon? Maybe someone can explain that to me using small words since I was up at 3:30am with a teething baby...

[Helen]

Moxie! Thank you!!!

I can now re-start my life.

On cloth diapering -- I read your posts back in the day when my sweetpea was small, about 18 months ago. I remember feeling bad about not cloth diapering. We live in a small one bedroom with laundry in the basement (12 floors down), and my husband and I just could not face schlepping up and down to wash cloth dipes. Still, I felt like disposables (including the 7th Gen, which we use) just have to be worse for the environment than cloth. I think I'll check out the book Laura suggests to see what the two sides of the scientific debate say.

Actually, my husband and I hope to do some EC with the next one (whenever that will be), in part to lessen our environmental footprint.

I wouldn't change your CD posts, though. They stand on their own just fine. Agree with the link idea.

[Jennifer]

A hint! Hurrah! I finally know the hobby. Any word yet from pnuts momma?

I chose disposable diapers because Olivia is in daycare and cloth is not an option. Also because I already had more to deal wtih than I could handle with a new baby. Now with #2 on the way and the two babies only 17 months apart, I really have more than I can handle!

[Annika]

I, too, do not get what Laura is asking you to do. Not mention the reasons for choosing cloth at all? That would be... dumb.

[Nutmeg]

I'm an ecologist and a scientist and a former environmental educator too. I cloth diaper my kid.

I researched it and the union of concerned scientists comes down in the middle on the environmental issue, basically stating that if you live in an area where water use is a bigger issue than waste disposal, then go for disposables. I think that I disagree with the UCS on this, however. It would be very difficult to accurately depict all the costs that go in to the production of the disposable diapers (including transportation) and it would be difficult to clearly isolate all the costs of producing cloth (the cotton, the microfiber, the fleece oh my!)

But I look at it this way... if washing things is no better than buying, throwing away and rebuying things, why don't we wear disposable clothes, use disposable dishes and just use all those fun plastic bags all the time. Why do we make all sorts of decisions that focus on reusing, reducing and recylcing, except that somehow when it comes to diapers, it doesn't wash out? (pun intended).

And Moxie... I agree totally about the how you diaper/feed your kid doesn't make you a better parent than anyone else and I got that from your post.

I don't feel like you made yourself out to be an authority on anything on this blog(honestly, you couldn't convince me you thought you were, even if you tried.... though obviously you are probably an authority on something!) All of this is especially so, since your introduction which briefly mentions possible environmental benfits is just a few sentences of what is obviously just a post about the different ways someone can cloth diaper and NOT about values or environmental choices.

[Anon]

I don't really have an opinion on your original post or Laura's letter, but I wanted to comment on what you said about how cloth diaper users are viewed as better mothers than disposable diaper users. I never thought about this, but it's totally true. I love your blog, but when I went into your archives and read about cloth diapering, my first thought is, "Oh, she's one of THOSE moms. And here I thought she was one of us regular people."

I have this one friend who always makes me feel inferior due to what I perceive as her perfect mothering, and when I tell others about her, the first piece of evidence I cite for her perfection is her use of cloth diapers. I personally chose disposables because, well, I think it's kind of gross to have poop in my washing machine.

I think one of the reasons this is such an emotionally-charged issue is that it is one of the first decisions we make as parents, and we make it in that stage of parenting where we believe every possible choice we make will have far-reaching consequences in our children's lives. So the comparison, guilt, and self-doubt start early, and at a time when you don't have the perspective that a more seasoned parent does. I mean, the reality is, when our kids are in kindergarten together, will the issue of who had cloth and who had disposable even come up?

[JC Carvill]

I find that you can't please everyone all of the time and cloth diapers are one of those issues. Every body is always going to agree or disagree because I think its a personal issue. You believe in what you believe in...that's all that matters. :)

[shirky]

moxie is the only place on the internet i can come and not want to cry about parenting. that includes the cloth diapers stuff. The only thing is I am even lazier than anyone and wash really simply, without extra steps.

the other thing: I noticed that and wondered. I still don't get how that comes up during play time or is visible to visitors.

Although I once had a type of job where you go to people's living spaces to fix things and I did see things.

[rudyinparis]

I would need to go back and reread your posts on CD, but I do recall that I LIKED your quote unquote simplistic approach--quick, no-nonsense, no preaching. And it was so fabulous to find a bare-bones, here's-how-to-do-it. It was this information that brought me to your site originally, way back when.

I came for the cloth diapering, and stayed for the S&M! Moxie, you are too funny.

[Leah]

Ok, wait, I found something. This sort of helps answer my question, though without any scientific support that I am assuming would be in the book.

http://go.ucsusa.org/publications/nucleus.cfm?publicationID=241
I am still unclear whether he thinks that laundering diapers takes more water and energy than simply disposing of disposables, or if he includes the manufacturing process with that. But as I said, I would need to get the book and it's honestly just not *that* important to me right now.

I, personally, am not sold on this group - people of all political leanings use cloth diapers and care about the environment, but as a libertarian I am very squeamish about the group cited in this post. That doesn't really matter to what you're asking, Moxie, I just don't think you really need to change your lovely CDing posts because someone wrote a book disagreeing with something you said.

[Sarah]

First, thank you for the hint!!

Maybe I didn't read your cloth diapering posts clearly enough: I skimmed through to find the information/advice that I was looking for, but I didn't read them the way Laura did, if I am understanding her correctly.

I think most people associate cloth diapering with an environmental stance or choice so it is appropriate to mention that, even in passing, before moving on the the mechanics of the whole thing.

By the way, some of my inserts are stinky for some reason so I am off to search your archives to see if there is any idea on how to clean them better.

[Julie]

I am slower than most.....it took me a while and I'm glad I didn't slog through the CD posts looking for hidden hints.

Thank you Moxie!!!!!!!

I have no current thoughts on the topic for today because I am still digesting the hint, my new knowledge and why on earth these people would advertise something like that on the internet. Maybe later I'll be in the mood to think about cloth diapering.

[Allison]

As a mom who did disposables, then CD, then back to disposables, I didn't find the intro offensive. Then again, I feel comfortable with my reasons for moving back to 'sposies -- living in the West with extremely hard water, it was WAY worse to rinse out every. single. load. five. times. Oh, and I'd still get ammonia stink.

My DH, who's quite an environmentalist in most ways, loves the disposables and isn't particularly interested in re-exploring cloth (he wasn't around for my go with it -- we only married a year ago) for our next baby in the Spring, but since we're moving, I might seriously consider it. Oh, the fluff. How I loved the fluff -- when it wasn't stinky, anyway!

[Jeanette]

Our daycare requires disposable.
I have a Terra Pass for my car can I get a Pooper Pass for my child?

[Shannon]

I am not a scientist of any kind but when i read about scientists being split about whether cloth is as environmentally damaging as disposable diapers, it strongly brings to mind the "scientific disagreements" about whether smoking is bad for you back in the 70s/80s, and the current disagreement about whether or not global warming is really taking place.

I don't have the knowledge to say that's what's going on here but it would be naive to think that all of the research on this issue is funded by neutral parties.

I am by no means a cloth zealot and use disposables almost exclusively, which is my version of being lazy. I also enjoy the occasional cigarette (not around my kids of course), but that doesn't mean that I shouldn't know that it's bad for me and adjust my expectations and other behaviour accordingly (disposable diaper guilt does help motivate me to be environmentally responsible in other avenues).

If you are going to rely on research to make a decision you may wish to consider the source.

[Charisse]

Heh. My babylon-by-the-bay radar was right. I'd stick by my response to the original.

(No idea on the cloth diapers--never tried it knowing Mouse would be going to daycare, never really felt sensitive about it.)

[MrsHaley]

I'm with Julie ... Why put that on the internet?

Golf clubs would be easier to explain.

[Linda]

Re: the Hobby. I am now dying to know exactly what she found online that led her to these parents, if it really is them. How indiscreet!

Re: cloth diapering. It took me till the 3rd paragraph to figure out if Laura was happy or unhappy with your cloth diapering posts. Maybe I need more coffee. Anyway, I agree that people hold it up as the Paragon of Motherhood and guilty feelings sometimes follow. I joke about cloth diapering so I can feel morally superior, but I guess there are people out there who actually believe that.

As for your posts, I think they're fine (although I do cloth diaper so I am probably biased) and have sent the links to multiple people who have asked me how to get started.

[snickollet]

I think I see what Laura is getting at, and I agree with her. I have read the (very compelling) UCS book, and what I took away from it re: diapering is that it's not clear cut. If you use cloth, you don't get a free pass to think that you are more environmentally conscious than those who use disposables. My takeaway was that diapering is hard on the environment no matter what you decide to do, a lesser of two evils situation, if you will. (Please don't ask me to recall the details of the argument--I read the book years ago!)

I use disposables (single mom of twins--the startup cost and the thought of any more loads of laundry were too much for me to bear). And that said, here, Moxie, is what I find offensive in the "Cloth Diapering, Part I" post:

"I do think it reflects the importance you place on preserving natural resources, which is another important topic, but it's not directly related to parenting."

I think it's unfair to assume, as this statement seems to suggest you could, that someone who uses disposables is less concerned about preserving natural resources than someone who uses cloth.

If the posts are really just meant to be a How-To for people who have already made the decision, then the intro could be kept to "So, you're going to cloth diaper. Here's how it works." You could write a separate post on the decision-making process and the factors involved in the choice.

As if you don't have enough to do :).

[geobrarian]

Moxie, I've referred to your cloth diaper posts several times, when we our daughter was first born and we gave cloth a try, (and now 18 months later when we decided to return to cloth at night and on the weekends) and have found it really helpful.

As a librarian with a subject specialty in environmental science, and the wife of a environmental scientist, I did wonder about your hierarchy, but didn't read too much into it, and don't think you need to change it. I appreciate Laura's email though and Nutmeg's comment because it is interesting to think through the extensive connections implicit in the choices we make.

When I first researched the issue and went with a diaper service, the whole idea of taking into account their energy use and their practices made my head spin. In the end, people seem to fixate on one or two aspects of the cloth/disposable debate and let that guide their choice--for me, of late, it's the somewhat irrational idea that my daughter's butt should be surrounded by natural fibers, and the hope that cloth might be one tiny tiny step closer to underwear.

What I like about your posts, and Laura's email, is that they've given me pause to place my own fixation in the larger scheme of things. Good to do that every so often. Your posts helped me remember that this doesn't have to be an either/or issue--a little of both has worked well for us. I suppose that applies to your site in general, so thanks.

[ImpostorMom]

I think that your cloth diapering posts are very helpful. However, I can see where Laura is coming from but not quite to that extreme. I believe that the choice to cloth diaper or not is more than just a choice about the environment. That is sometimes only one piece of the puzzle. We use bumGenius exclusively (they are awesome, btw) but we came to this decision by weighing cost, ease of use and environmental impact.

I think the issue with your post is that the paragraph ranking things by environmental impact could be implied that it is all about environmental impact and that isn't true. Also, I think that the impact depends a lot on your area and what is more important, landfill usage or water conservation. I also thought this argument was a load of crap but I now find myself considering going to disposables for a while because I live in an area that is dealing with a serious drought. Like we are going to run out of water in a month's time.

I have begun limiting my son's baths and our plants haven't seen a drop of water in months. So I can see where that would be a consideration for someone in my area. In addition to that, I have seen some research that says diaper services are actually more efficient than individual people washing diapers.

Whether or not you change your post is completely up to you. I wouldn't say that any of the information you supplied is necessarily wrong from your experience but simply that it may not apply everywhere and there are many other contributing factors.

I honestly wish I had found your site and that particular post when I was researching cloth diapering systems. Oh and I learned something, I'm changing our detergent. I have been using AFC and haven't had any problems but hey why risk having to strip them. Thanks for all you do. :)

[Jill]

When I investigated cloth v disposable, I realized I had always ignored one important point. In Atlanta we have a severe water shortage. Atlanta does not have a landfill problem. Many cities are not in this same situation, but that is part of what makes this decision different for different families. We each do things for our environment, but we're really all in slightly different environments.

[Jill]

And if that is their hobby, how would a visiting child see it? Seems something that would be kept in privacy even from one's own children. I guess it leaves some room to wonder about the type of parent they are, but if you're in doubt, meet the parents in a neutral zone and then make a decision, or go with your child to check out the home. Heck, even if it was golf that bothered you, give them a chance and meet them before passing judgment.

[Melanie]

Moxie!!! AHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAA! You are such a sly devil! Nicely done. And I wouldn't have any probs with that hobby as long as they didn't try to get my kid involved with it.

I think that Laura should start her own blog about cloth diapering and environmentalism if she thinks that what you wrote is somehow lacking. She's not your editor and it's a slippery slope -- if you rewrite according to one person's opinion, you run the risk of others challenging you on your sleep posts or whatever.

[hedra]

"The kind of diapers you use has nothing to do with your parenting. I do think it reflects the importance you place on preserving natural resources, which is another important topic, but it's not directly related to parenting."

I read the 'it' as the decision process, not the actual diapers you end up selecting. It took me a re-read to see that it might have meant (and could be taken as) the actual choice. And the followup sequence does imply that there is only one hierarchy. But again, when you started talking 'costs of washing' I went right to 'including environmental costs', so it read to me like a 'here's one list, and then when you consider the other side, it affects the list'.

But that's my read, from my personal angle, which is pretty similar to the framework noted - that each area has different issues, different costs, and the balance differs by all the factors (including where you live and what machine you have and how the cotton was grown and what brand disposable and how far that had to be shipped to your store, etc.), so that the decision has to be checklisted carefully to determine if you're saving much one way vs the other.

In our area, landfill is a HUGE HUGE issue, and water is just a big one. With a front-loader, the environmental balance seems to be toward cloth. Out west where I grew up, it would be the reverse.

And I want to highlight what Anon said above, "I think one of the reasons this is such an emotionally-charged issue is that it is one of the first decisions we make as parents, and we make it in that stage of parenting where we believe every possible choice we make will have far-reaching consequences in our children's lives." -- I've seen that in so many of the decisions we make, that those early parenthood choices take on such weight and import, and form our self-concept as parents, and we're loath therefore to look at them too closely in harsh light, and defend them AS right, rather than determining if they WERE right (if there is such a thing, and mainly it ends up being 'right for us, your mileage may vary'). :shrug:

We did disposables, disposables, cloth, g-diapers, and back to disposables. Each time it was as right a decision as we could manage. We work on our environmentalism in many ways, and this one isn't one of the biggest issues for us. Prefer cloth, overall, but M's skin freaks out. Doing it for one twin part-time (not at preschool)... just not a go.

I'm figuring the hobbists frequent some kind of topic-related site. The folks I know who like that sort of thing are pretty creative and like to seek out new ideas and share their own. :shrug: Indiscreet, perhaps, but I just know too many of those hobbyists (and have had discussions about the values, imlications, benefits to their lives, etc., it's really interesting) to find it at all alarming. Might be hard to EXPLAIN, and yeah, might not want to try to explain it before, say, high school... but certainly doesn't nix anyone from my list of 'folks whose houses are acceptable' (certainly most aren't that overt about it, so how would I know if some of the other parents are just not advertising the fact?).

[mezzaluna]

i used to feel really strongly about cloth diapers until i discovered EC - props to Helen for mentioning it! you are going to use natural resources with cloth or disposables... but EC takes you out of the whole diapering paradigm...

now at the moment i go through a lot of cloth diapers, especially because i remove them after one pee rather than letting a few build up... but i hope to have DD out of diapers at a young age, and that's where the huge savings come in, environmentally. DS was out of diapers at 16 months... at that point he was wetting approximately one pair of training pants every 24 hours, so that's as often as i would have changed his undies anyway.

also want to mention about daycares - some daycares just need a little education - with pocket diapers like bumGenius, i don't know why they would be any different from disposables in a daycare setting?? my daycare was willing to do cloth, but i preferred to have my DS in disposables there so that he wouldn't feel wet and not get changed right away (i couldn't use pockets with him as his skin was too sensitive to the polyester fabric).

[Maureen2]

Okay, I'm feeling really lame today. I am one of those that was dieing (dying?) to know what the hobby was and I can't "get" the hint. Ugh.

[Kat]

No, you should not change your post! It's your blog, your perspective, and it isn't offensive anyway. We CD. In the beginning, we used disposables on my daughter and then converted. No one can convince me that those big bags of used diapers we lugged to the garbage bin every night is better for the enviornment than the cloth diapers we used over and over again and will be used on our second child due in December. And then another child as I will give them so someone else!

Besides, I'd MUCH rather have natural fibers against my child's bum. Currently, my daughter (now 2 1/2) only uses diapers (cloth) at night and for naps. For a time we went back to disposables because I couldn't get a night CD system down that didn't leak. I finally found one, and now she refuses to wear disposables and will only wear cloth - they are more comfortable, she says.

[M]

Like many others, I first found this site when researching cloth diapers, and I found the general tone of the posts refreshing compared to much of what's out there. More importantly, your posts contain some of the best comparative info I've found (belated thanks!). I always send these posts to people who ask me about cloth diapering. Because we did end up cloth diapering, exclusively at first, though we've gradually shifted to now using all disposable, as she increased time in daycare.

I appreciate that all your posts manage to be open and supportive while still expressing an opinion. So many parenting advice outlets are either strongly one-sided, or try so hard to be all-inclusive that they end up saying nothing. I think it is completely fair to mention your personal conclusions about the environmental impact of various diapering choices. You clearly state on this site that you are not purporting to be an expert on any matter.

There is one update that your posts could use. Tragiclly, ebay no longer allows used cloth diapers or diaper covers to be auctioned on their site. I don't doubt that some alternative means of buying used diapers has sprung up, and I bet your readers can point the way!

[hedra]

Maureen2, check 'reading is my hobby' in the sidebar... who would, say, as a couple, be into those books?

[Julie]

pnuts mama???? Now that I have the hobby off my mind, I'm thinking about you.

:)

[Brooke]

I think the water issue is a bit...misleading. I know of exactly no one who uses disposables correctly by dumping the poop into the toliet. Throwing human feces into landfills risks contaminating the groundwater. Which is the last thing we want to be doing, especially when water is scarce.

Also, before you decide that you can't do cloth because of a daycare situation, check the DCFS regulations. They may not be allowed to require disposables (especially if you have a dr's note). Which is not to say you have to do cloth, but it may be more of an option than it first appears.

It took me a good long time to figure out that the hint didn't have anything to do with cloth diapers.

[rudyinparis]

Yeah, this is me, scrolling up:

Hungry caterpillar--they eat bugs? No, that can't be it... {scroll} Hand, hand, finger, thumb--okay, vaguely sexual, maybe, but that's a pretty vague way... {scroll} Achoo! Bang! Crash!... well, that doesn't make any sense at all... hmmm... {scroll} children who smelled a rat? What, they're pro-rat? Their house is rat infested? WTF? {scroll, scroll} Oh! Ohhhhhhh.

[mary]

I have to agree with Snickollet -- I think the issue is the absolutism of the statement "I do think it reflects the importance you place on preserving natural resources, which is another important topic, but it's not directly related to parenting."

The impact on the natural resources is murky at best, in my mind, and this statement almost makes it appear "CD = caring about the environment" and "disposables = wasteful", when it is not as clear-cut as that.

People's interest in preserving natural resources can not be easily discerned by what kind of diapers their kid wears or what they drive, etc.

Other than that one sentence, I think it's really good.

[pnuts mama]

ok, at first i was like, "cloth diapering is the hobby? what? not that EC thing again?"

theeeeeeeeeeeeeeen...just like rudy in paris/minnesota/shan-gri-la i scoured through your reading suggestions up top there and said to myself "OHHHHHHH..."
i do love the fact that they are online about it...would like it better if they were furries.

THANKS, MOXIE!!

as far as cloth vs. disposable, i haven't read the comments yet, but if laura is trying to point out that the overall environmental impact of cloth vs. dispo isn't as clear-cut as some would like to think (i.e.: if you are using most types of commercial detergents or chlorine bleach to wash said diapers, then you are putting lots of bad stuff into the earth's water system, probably the same as the chemicals used in a contemporary dispo diaper, etc. etc.) well, that's fair.

it's not necessarily fair to drop a big load of sanctimommy over a post that was primarily written to help parents who are trying to learn as much as they can about cloth diapering and make their own informed decisions based on one woman's post on the topic. perhaps laura feels since so many of us come here and get so much from each other and you especially, moxie, that that post could have some undue influence with regards to cloth vs. dispo, in terms of this audience. it's good that people have time to micro-analyze these issues, it's how we re-shape, re-fine, and re-form our ideas, (hopefully) learning more each time.

now if we'd all like to get into a deep discussion over the social justice issues surrounding how we care for the environment and the marginalized people who create over 75% of our disposable goods, i'm all for it. because really, the diaper issue is just the tip of the proverbial iceberg!

[pnuts mama]

julie, well this is just embarrassing...

my husband wants me to wait til after halloween to test to be sure i've missed my period...i bought a 2pack and i'll try one tonight for all of you (oh, and me) and one for next week just in case the results are inconclusive. thank you for caring! it's sweet and makes me feel a little embarrassed!

and now, back to your regularly scheduled programming...

[Eve]

One of these days, I'm going to learn left from right. I was reading the ads on the right and going, "They send e-cards for Halloween?"

As for the CD posts, I found them incredibly helpful when I started the process. But I didn't really switch for environmental reasons -- so I skimmed over that part of the post and focused more on the explanations of which ones to pick and how to wash them.

I would agree with a PP who said it's a slippery slope; you don't want to get started editing everything you write just because someone else might have a different opinion.

[pnuts mama]

ok, last one.

did the couple have a specific room in their home for said activities? does either parent walk around with collar and leash all day long? i'm still stuck on how what people do "under covers" (ahem) would influence a five year old on a playdate. were they involving other people in their fun&games? i guess that could be where the morality issue could pop up (no pun intended).

also, who uses their real names online like that? hi, i'm jane doe and i live in delaware and my husband john and i love to spank each other!" i mean, who doesn't use a pseudonym online? especially when you are online for that?

done.obsessing.now.

[Kathy]

I, too, had read (in an environmental magazine) that diaper services use less water, electricity, and detergent than washing at home. (Economies of scale and all that.)

To trade/resell cloth diapers:
www.diaperswappers.com

You can find my personal favorite, Fuzzi Bunz, for an amazing price!

[Shanna]

Nine month old twins here and I still haven't gotten around to "trying out cloth diapers." Environment be damned, I just want the (supposed) early toilet learning benefits. I don't think there's anything wrong with your earlier posts, and if they make me feel a little guilty...well, they should.

As for the other thing: yay! I guessed right even without the hints. (Sort of. I had it narrowed down to two somewhat related things. That was one of them.)

[Shanna]

Also, Brooke:

If you count knowing people online, now you know one family that does this. :) (Well, when the poop is solid enough. We're still in BF-to-solids-poop transiition mode.)