Discussion: School year length

I've started reading the Chronicles of Narnia. The only one I read as a kid was The Lion, The Witch, and The Wardrobe, so when I saw them in the children's section of the library last week I decided to read the whole series. So last night instead of writing a Q&A for Ask Moxie I was finishing up The Horse and His Boy. Sorry about that.

But it does give me the perfect chance to bring up something that's been bothering me for a few days. I found out that there are some school systems that started classes already for the fall last week. The first full week of August. And my immediate reaction was that that was immoral. (Yes, immoral. I think my co-workers thought that was a little hyperbolic, too.)

I feel like since kids don't choose to go to school, they shouldn't be forced to go for as many hours as adults can squeeze into the day and year. They should have a ton of downtime to think their own thoughts and control their own actions. Starting school so early in August just seems wrong to me, like the adults in charge think that without school the kids will be running wild. And I don't think having a longer year is really affecting how well kids learn. It's just giving teachers more time to teach to the standardized tests. (I can't imagine being excited to come back to work for that.)

I realize, of course, that some of this also has to do with financial and logistical pressures on parents. Since most families don't have an adult home full-time anymore, it's easier and cheaper to have kids in school as much of the year as possible. But I don't think that's good for kids. I'd rather have my kids in a daycamp playing games and running around than in school (which may not even have a single recess during the 6-hour school day, but that's a whole different issue entirely) for the summer. But daycamp costs money, and school is free. What choice can parents really make?

Yes, this is whole bundle of problems. Can we sort it out today in the comments section? What do you think about the expanding school year?

Comments

[vickie]

Hmm. I feel that kids do need to have more time to play & think--and not always toward a goal like "learning something". But I do agree with a criticism of the American school system about its school year (lengthwise it's shorter than other developed nations').

I think that if kids were in school 46-48 weeks of the year, they should have more time for schoolyard play, quiet time, etc. It would be really detrimental if they were in school for so many days and not have time for unstructured learning.

[Amy]

Are they actually having more days at school, or just starting early? When I was in middle/high school they started earlier and earlier every year, but they kept the number of school days the same, so we got longer breaks for holidays, etc. It was kind of nice to have those longer breaks mid-year, but summer was pretty short and it was harder to get a summer job.

[Peach]

Around these parts (central Indiana) the school year was expanded because of the increased numbers of tests and testing for NCLB. Mandatory testing now takes up almost four weeks of the school year (prep weeks plus the actual testing weeks) so they added some weeks on at the beginning and end to make up for it.

I'm not sure I like that solution, but at least they're trying... I think they need to try a little harder to figure out how to deal with NCLB and basic, you know, learning, but hey.. that's just me.

[mary]

Around here (Nebraska), school is starting today or later this week. But the kids get out really early -- usually before Memorial Day. So the school year is the same length, just shifted earlier.

It's miserably hot here -- wouldn't it make more sense to wait until it cools off a little in September and have them go a little longer in June when it's not so hot?

[hedra]

I'm on board for expanded school CALENDAR, but longer breaks.

I know a fair number of teachers, and the opinions are mixed, though there are a lot of them who would love for kids to come back to school in the Fall not having forgotten most of the previous year's content. A shorter break in the summer is thought to reduce the over-summer loss. School discipline and rules as well as content go out the window.

I knew someone online outside the US who went to school where they had a variety of 3-6 week breaks, with school year-round. She (having lived that way) thought that the 6 week break was perfect for a longer break - it was enough to start getting bored and having to invent new ways to entertain oneself, without being so long that everyone and everything was different when school started up again.

Granted, I loved the long summer thing, myself - but I did also feel like I was dusting off my brain and having to grind the gears each Fall. I think any way you go is a mixed bag - some up, some down.

[AmyinMotown]

I'm favor of a longer year. My teacher friends HATE the first month because the kids have slipped so much from where they were at the end of the year. I am more in favor of the European system, with a monthlong break around December and another in the summer. It's only a little longer than the standard American school year but avoids those long brain-softening weeks of summer vacation. The current system evolved because of the agricultural economy which we've moved far away from now.

That being said, I do think early August is too early to start, but maybe mid-August (like next week) would be fine. Summer's lost its charm by then, and colleges are starting around then.

I also think you may be idealizing how kids spend their summers. Many of the rich parents I know are all about the academically enriching activities dring the summer and there's not a lot of room for play. Or there's lots of TV watching--I know I scheduled my summer day around what cartoons I liked as a kid.

[Jan]

Is the school year actually getting longer, or is the timing of it just changing?

The minimum number of hours spent in school is federally mandated, isn't it? And isn't that why we have snow days? To make up enough to get to that federal minimum?

I honestly think kids would be better off if they had more days of school per year, but spread out more, or differently. The original reason for the long summer off, as I understand it (kids needing to be home to help with the harvest) has pretty much gone by the wayside.

Maybe if we ran school year-round, with one-week spring, summer, fall and winter breaks, our kids wouldn't have so much transition time (stressful), we could start seeing teachers as professionals and, God forbid, pay them accordingly and kids would have some time in every day for thinking their own thoughts and controlling their own actions.

[lynn]

Each state has their own rules, but generally they're all around 180 days long. It's just that some states start and end earlier than others. I know in Massachusetts we start after Labor Day and end mid-June, but in Missouri, for example, they start in August and finish in May. I don't know why there's so much variation - I thought it had something to do with the expense of running air conditioning in southern states, but I'm not sure that makes sense.

If we could overhaul the system, I wouldn't mind a longer school year if it could have more recess and electives built into it.

[Erika]

I grew up in North Carolina and now living in Virginia (and married to an elementary school teacher), it's strange to me that school doesn't start until after Labor Day. I guess where I grew up it was too hot to go to school almost until the end of June. But I think the post-Labor Day start is a nice tradition.

Like a previous poster mentioned, I went to "year-round" school in middle school - in school for a 9 week term, and then a 3 week break, with 1 week in between grades. I loved it. I had 2 working parents and was too old for day care (and an only child), so I didn't have too much time to be bored. All my friends were on the same schedule so those with stay-at-home parents could arrange outings. And we took off-season vacations, like Disney world in early November. This option is terrific, but they never worked out the logistics for a high school (extracurricular activities) so it was back to regular schedule for me after 8th grade.

[enu]

I seem to have internalized my Mom's opinion that school is a complete waste of time more than I thought. (Pushing off thoughts of a 3rd Masters - but it would be FREE.... they're kinda like potato chips)

School in August? Why, we might as well just outlaw fun and happiness. Even an open hydrant on the corner's better than school! Last day of school was the best day of the year and first day of school was a little like death. Death in August... too cruel.

[ellen landrum]

Here in Florida they had to pass a law to keep school systems from opening more than 2 weeks before labor day- many districts were tacking on a few extra weeks (beyond the 180 days I attended as a kid), to meet the demands of testing.

AAAaaaarrgghhh! is all I have to say to that. I don't believe in standardized tests for little ones and for that reason, will not send my daughter to a school in this state (hopefully we'll be traveling on our boat by then and she'll be homeschooling for at least a portion of elementary school).

I second the comment favoring the European system- there are some schools in the states that do a similar calendar with more frequent, longer breaks. It makes so much more sense to me. Mothering Mag. recently did a piece about disappearing recesses- another big problem. But it seems that the recess issue is linked back to the testing/longer school year. Without a fundamental overhaul of the ed. system (and elimination of the ridiculous and punitive NCLB act), we won't see any changes soon.

[Kelly]

I really support the Japanese style of school year. All year long, with several-weeks long breaks every 3m or so. More consistency for kids but still giving them much needed downtime, more frequently.

[Lisa V]

Most schools that start this early get out in May rather than June or they have extended breaks through out the year.

Bert and I were discussing this yesterday, they have been contemplating moving the start date up for our high schools here- to mid August. I hate this. Our elementary school starts the Tuesday after Labor Day, which seems like when school should start.
However, I have the luxury that I was a SAHM and last year when I worked during the summer I have a 13 year old and 15 year old to supervise the younger children.

I think summer is a long delicious break. I love it. My niece was on a year round calendar and everyone concerned hated it, her parents, her and her friends who weren't on the same schedule.

[Fahmi]

I was wondering the same thing that many people wondered, if the schools starting in August meant the schools were closing in May. My mother-in-law (1st grade teacher) has that school schedule, and I have a hard time remembering it, since I went to school after Labor Day and we had our last day of school in late June.

That said, I loved the school system in Japan. We started for the the year in April, and we had about six weeks off for the summer - middle of July to end of August - and then another nice stretch of a holiday in the winter, and another in the spring after the school year ended. It didn't feel like the year was longer, but most importantly, having it broken up in chunks made a huge difference. We weren't just longing for a long vacation six months down the road.

Seems like in NYC, they are lengthening spring break a little (it was two weeks instead of the normal 1 weeks last year) and having some more breaks to break up the monotony of sitting still.

While I agree it's too hot to go to school in August, I am not sure if our school calendar as it stands is that good for our mental state anyway - I was glued to the TV all day.

[giddy]

Erika, I grew up in Virginia--where school starts after Labor Day because it is required by law. They did try moving it earlier one year (or maybe several), but when they did, all the beach communities lost a lot of money because Labor Day is a big moneymaker for those areas. So, lobbyists from those communities prevailed upon the state gov't to enact a law....I suspect that this could be similar for other eastern seaboard states (someone mentioned Massachusetts--surely people on the Cape and in Martha's Vineyard want Labor Day tourist dollars?) (MV is Mass, isn't it?)

But I also think it makes sense from an air conditioning point of view. August is a lot hotter than June in most places.....

[shirky]

Summer was my only refuge as a kid. During the year, I would endure months of bullying, torment, humiliation, and disdain at the hands of the rich and popular. Come summer, I would head for summer camp, where no one knew I was a lame-o, where no one knew who was rich, where years of social hierarchy had not been built, and where I was free to do pretty much as I liked as long as I turned up for meals and swam with a buddy. Those are some of the absolute best times of my entire life.

I once expressed this to someone who was advocating year round school, and was made to feel like an elitist pig since not everyone can afford summer camp.

Shit, if my kid needs summer camp like I needed summer camp, well, I'll find a way.

I am not a fan of the extended school day either. Damn. Imagine being in an environment that beats you down for 8 hours instead of 6? Shit. I'll fucking homeschool (and I hate homeschool) before I let my kid get emotionally wrecked for 8 hours a day.

Of course, he may really dig school. I can't relate though.

[jenn]

Some districts also have moved to year-round or otherwise unconventional scheduling to alleviate overcrowding (or, you know, longterm lack of infrastructure investment) -- ie, having 2 groups of kids on slightly staggered schedules so buildings are in use more of the year.

[Cecily T]

Just have to weigh in here as a teacher. I agree that there's some 'brain rot' that happens during the summer and you do have to cover content to catch up to what is considered the current content for the year. I think the larger issue and the source of Moxie's discomfort is that schools are too much like, well, schools, and not enough like daycamps with time to free-think, run around, and have fun. It is a fundamental problem with the school paradigm in most American schools. If learning were more student-directed (don't get me wrong, they'd have to be shown how to do that, b/c they are so used to sitting at a desk and having a teacher talking at them), then school wouldn't seem like such a bad thing.

[sweetisu]

I attended elementary school in China. I don't remember exactly how long summer vacation/break was, however, I do remember the school DAYS and WEEKS were very long. It was all I knew and it didn't bother me one bit. I learned a lot and was 3 years ahead in math compared to my peers when I came to the states.

I do agree there needs to be an overhaul of the school system here. In junior high and high school, I was bored to death during the summer, basically glued to the TV or camped out at the library. My parents didn't have money to send me to summer camps. And when everyone returned to school in the fall, a lot of kids have forgotten what they've learned the previous year and the first month or two were catch-up months.

Now that I'm a parent of two, I think a longer school year with more frequent breaks would benefit both the children and the parents as well. Especially for SAHMs or SAHDs, the summer is just too long!!

[Ami]

I think schools are for fish.

However, if after considering every single educational alternative there is, based on the needs of the individual child, a parent decides they want their child in public school, I am in favor of shorter school days that don't start so early in the morning, a shorter school year, and more opportunities for children and young adults to learn away from the institutional model.

More days spent cramming for tests and more marching in lines and more deskwork isn't necessary.

Sadly,education and actual learning are mutually exclusive.

[Steph]

Here in California the minimum length of the school year is determined not in hours, but in MINUTES, and my (admittedly limited) experience is that the school year is as long as the minimum, no more, even in the better districts. Don't know if that's because of the teachers' union, or our abysmal school funding, or what. Some districts have a longer school day, but more breaks. My kids start school on August 15 and finish May 31, which makes Memorial Day a bit of a joke. Personally, I think a 10 week break is too long, that the kids end up spending too much time at the beginning of the year getting back up to speed. DH and I both work fulltime and the kids go to a variety of camps like cheezy day camp, short sleepaway camps, and spendier stuff like boating camp and science camp. I do feel they are too busy, regardless of the time of year.

[MrsHaley]

Right on, Cecily! I'm a 10-year teaching vet. and I agree that school doesn't HAVE to be all about lines and desks and papers and checklists ... but thanks to NCLB, that's what it is. I'm a SAHM now and SO RELIEVED to be out from under the soul-crushing behemoth public education has become.

That said, the European / Japanese school year model (3 months on / 1 month off, or thereabouts) does seem more helpful for retention, etc. It would require a whole revamping of the extracurricular systems (sports schedules, etc). Can you IMAGINE messing with SPORTS?!? Perish the thought!!

[Cathy]

We're Florida peeps too. Our district starte on July 31 last year. It is way too hot for PE (or recess) in August here, IMHO.

The monkey (starting 8th grade next week) did seem to have a week off in the fall and a week off in the spring, plus there was a Thursday off here and a Friday off there throughout the year. He was out of school around May 25 or so. The first semester was able to end before the winter holiday break too.

As someone else mentioned, Florida had to legislate the earliest start date. They also have a sales tax holiday week - for school clothes and school supplies. Frankly, the two were not in sync this year which is very annoying to me.

[k]

A school I'm in boundaries for in Washington, DC applied to be part of a pilot program next year to run as a year round school. The plan as I was told last year was there'd be 4(?) breaks of a few weeks each, which would be run like a daycamp and would be optional to students (teachers who elected to work would be paid overtime). Not having a summer break would take some getting used to - but... there is a lot of appeal also. I think the kids would benefit from not having the longer periods of time to forget things. I think they'd also benefit from being in a safe environment with good role models available (our neighborhood is "transitional"). I think if the programs are well run it takes a lot of pressure off the parents to figure out what to do with the kids. There are kids in our neighborhood who are running loose with minimal to no supervision. It's great to see kids out doing kid things, but some of them are getting pulled into the wrong kinds of influences.

But - it would also be good, I think, for the kids to have a good amount of time to do kid stuff - explore what they want to do, veg out, whatever. At the same time I like these other ideas, I don't want to see every minute of their day programmed for them.

[Adrianne]

My husband is a teach in VA and he's at a year-round school. Their summer is usually about 5 weeks long and they go back to school August 1. However, they have a 3 week break in October and another one in March. Most of the teachers he works with really enjoy their schedules because in southern VA its too hot to be outside or doing much of anything in August, so they'd rather just be in school and in the AC. However, Oct and March, 2 of the most pleasant months in our area, they have free and clear. Not to mention, those months are not huge vacation times so traveling is a little easier and cheaper.

[ABCD]

This is a big reason why we homeschool. It takes us about 2 hours a day to do a full kindergarten curriculum. My kids get lots of down time to play and they are ahead of their peers academically.

[Karin]

Here in France, as noted, there are more breaks the kids go approx 160 days with more frequent breaks: 1.5 weeks around 1 November, 2 week at Christmas, 2 week "winter break" in February, 2 week spring break in April, and 8 weeks of summer.

also kids don't go to school on Wednesday (it is generally used for extracurricular activities & down time) and have two-hour lunches. Pre & post school-hours childcare is available at the school when classes are in session.

[Andromeda]

I teach in a private school. Our school year is a little shorter than those in the public schools around here (start after Labor Day, end early June, whereas they end mid-late June and I think start at the same time). We don't have the standardized test pressure, so maybe that's part of it. And we, uh, assign a lot of homework, so we can fit a fair amount in that time.

From my personal perspective as an adult, I would love to have the system some other people have mentioned -- more but shorter breaks. Summer's too long for me to use it effectively and I get bored with these vacations; I'd rather have a more normal schedule. I also agree that it would be silly if extra time (assuming, in fact, we added days doing this instead of redistributing) were all used in traditional ways. Starting the day later and doing a bit less each day, but having more days, would be awesome. Having some time to explore nontraditional things would be awesome (kind of like the January terms some colleges have).

From my perspective as a student, I hated my school and did really valuable things during the summer that I wouldn't have been able to do without that break. I think many of my students do valuable things over the summer too -- but that's because most of them are rich and can afford it. And some students, albeit not mine (too young) have jobs, which is a good thing too. If you changed the entire world to a new system, the vacation opportunities would adapt, but any one school that changes is going to be shutting its students out from a lot of things.

...but the people who say you would be able to spend a lot less time on review/recovery from brain rot are so right. Also the people who say it's not really fair to non-affluent parents.

I dunno. I think, as with many things in education, it's bad if every school runs on the same model, because students don't all run on the same model. I am very much in favor of some schools operating year-round. I don't think I'd want them all to. But I'd be happy to work at a school who did (ceteris paribus, natch).

[Andromeda]

Oh, and an awful lot of schools would have to be retrofitted for air conditioning, or have a lot of window boxes installed, possibly with electrical upgrades -- schools are built around a nine-month model and many of them, especially the older ones, are insane when it's hot. Not teach-in-able or learn-in-able conditions. Actually I don't think I've ever attended or taught in a school with air conditioning. So the facilities expenses alone might make this impractical for most places.

[ABCD]

This is a big reason why we homeschool. It takes us about 2 hours a day to do a full kindergarten curriculum. My kids get lots of down time to play and they are ahead of their peers academically.

[Charisse]

Mine's in a (private, montessori) preschool which is year-round and includes lots of out-and-about-town and running around time. Mr. C and I were just talking about what a transition kindergarten will be, and why on earth it couldn't me more like the current school. We've been watching our friends patch together a schedule of various 1-week and 2-week daycamps for their 6-year-old (nothing runs all summer)--they're well off and she'll be doing cool stuff, but it's been a big source of stress getting everything covered.

I loved spending most of the summer at the pool and hiking and so forth, but the only reason we got to do that was because my dad is an academic and has summers off as well.

I'm with those who think the schools need reform. I'd like to see all children get to do the kind of stuff rich kids get to do in the summer, and not necessarily only in the summer!

[Bobbi]

My kids go to private school. They start next week and go to the middle of June. Which seems like forever to me! But the more I thought about it, my kids are completely sick of summer right now. And they have what seems like at least one 4 day weekend every month, plus Thanksgiving (5 days), Christmas (2 weeks), Easter (5 days), and spring break. So there's a bunch of downtime incorporated in the year. As a parent, I'd like them done by Memorial day - I hate going until the second week in June, and they ar over it by then. Personally, I like the year round model, but I already feel like we push these kids too far too fast. So who knows what the right answer is...

[Carla Hinkle]

Here in San Diego it seems most of the schools start right after Labor day and go until mid-late June. The private ones get out a bit earlier, but not much.

Really, I just can't STAND school in August. It seems un-American and wrong. Where I grew up (northern California) we started going back in late August when I was in high school and I LOATHED it. I know kids are "over" summer by late August, but it is just very hard (for me) to get one's brain back into gear before the calendar says "September."

Now, my daughter is starting to wear on me a bit at this point -- 3 weeks until school starts. Camp is finished, etc. But having the nice, long summer gives us more flexibility about when to schedule a family vacation, have relatives visit, and just have some hang-around time.

I can see the attraction with more, shorter breaks throughout the year but my experience is everything just always feels rushed when that is the schedule. Always trying to squeeze in vacations, visits, activities, etc. I like the 2.5 months so that, for once, we can just while away a week or two and not be on such a time-clock.

[CN]

In this city, it's hot. It was 80 degrees F at 5:30 a.m. (before the sun was up), and will be over 100 degrees F most of today. This will go on until early October. (It isn't the high temperature that gets you, it is how long that high lasts.)

And, if the heat doesn't get you, the mosquitoes will. This time of year we park it inside.

**So, while our kids sit at home soaking up the last bits of summer A/C while bored, I say it's a good time to go to school.

Let our poor dears have some time off in October/November/December for running around and doing outdoor bug collecting. This time of year is the pits down here.

[snickollet]

Are a longer school year and more downtime mutually exclusive? Wouldn't being in school longer allow more downtime to be built into each individual day? Bring back recess! That's probably idealistic, but in theory, it could work that by adding days to the year, there would be less to cover in each individual day.

I think the year-round model with shorter, more frequent breaks is the way to go, personally, as far as what it the best learning environment for kids. (Better retention, more consistency, etc.) But that's predicated on downtime being built into the school day.

To me, the real problem is that each family is different, each child is different. We will all want slightly different things. There's no one answer on what the best solution is. I know what I want as a single working parent. But what's best for me is not going to be best for everyone. As with so many issues, it seems like a "one size fits most" model doesn't end up working all that well for anyone.

[Sheryl]

They started last week around here. The school year isn't longer though - they finish in mid-May. Some have told me it has something to do with hurricane season (I'm in Louisiana), others have said it has something to do with heat. I have no idea what the real answer is.

Sorry if someone said this already - didn't have time to read through all the posts.

[wavybrains]

I'm with Snickollet and other commenters like Cecily--year round school doesn't have to exclude child-led learning. I favor a system of year round school with more frequent, shorter breaks, and more down-time and active activities built into each day. I think the bigger issue in your post is not the length of the school year, but rather the need to teach to standardized tests. I'd like to see a push away from the testing and towards a more Montessori or Waldorf model of education. Short of that, the ability to structure your child's own academic calendar is certainly one of the big appeals of homeschooling.

[pnuts mama]

did something happen to recess?? is recess a thing of the past? is that possible? what happened to eating lunch and going outside to play? (or watching old warner bros cartoons in the auditorium if it was raining?) ah. nyc public schools- thank god for the UFT.

ok, i've calmed down. first, i'm wondering if it isn't the calendar this year that is dictating school starting earlier? my inlaws both work for a school district and they have two weeks off at the end of the year b/c christmas and new years are on tuesdays. so maybe that is influencing the calendar?

second, is camp an east coast thing? i'll tell you my husband and i were both camp kids, and i know neither one of us comes from a well-off family. camp is definitely a "luxury" (vs. necessity) but there are tons of day camps (and some sleep away, often church-run) that are reasonable. i remember summer being just long enough that i wanted to go back and see my friends after labor day. boo to school in august! (unless you are in college and you can't wait to get back)

finally- as an educator i like the idea of year-round with longer breaks (bring back recess and the arts!!), however, for those who work full time- how on earth do you manage childcare then? if you have two or three week breaks in non-summer months? then what? that would be a potential problem if you don't have a parent at home. i don't know, i don't remember school being such a drag on a traditional calendar- when you're a kid you only know what you know, you know?

[shirky]

pnuts mama,
I dunno, but I went to camp and it was affordable for my family, we weren't exactly the horsey set, you know? But when I say summer camp, people react like I have said "summering in Florence" or "Heli-skiing in Aspen". So that's how it's perceived in any case. About half the girls there got a scholarship or campership to be there. It was not fancy. There was no horses or anything expensive. It was cheaply run and fairly ramshackle. it was AWESOME.
I live in an urban area now but there are cheap/free options for kids in summer. City-run daycamps for kids and job programs for teens; Community Boating which is ONE dollar for the whole summer, every day, 9-3, that would keep a kid pretty entertained all summer. In a rural area, you wouldn't have these options but aren't rural kids free-range anyway?
The point is that I LOVED summer and HATED school and you won't find me backing any extension of school at the expense of beloved summer.

[heather]

Funny, this topic was covered in The Globe and Mail this past weekend (www.theglobeandmail.com, search for "Little benefits found to year-round schools").

I think "year-round" school is fine, provided there are enough "breaks" (one school in the article has "two weeks off in October, three weeks at Christmas, one week in February, two weeks in March and one month in the summer"). With these holidays, my guess is the kids are not in school any longer than those at regular schools.

[Ariella]

Considering how much learning and education kids lose throughout the summer (unless their parents are constantly and consistently reviewing with them, which is uncommon), I think longer school years are an excellent idea.

I do think that if school years are longer, then there should be other considerations (longer vacation, more vacations) so that they're not IN school all the time.

Traditionally, summer vacation was used as a way for kids to be able to help on the farm. Now, here in Wisconsin, this is still a valid concern for some parents/kids, however in the majority of northern America, it is not. So, I say, do away with those antiquated notions, put our kids in school longer, and hope that they learn better and faster because of it.

[Lisa C.]

The Texas Education Agency recently legislated that schools could not open earlier than the last week in August, and can't remain open past the 1st week in June, putting a stop to starting school on August 4 (very popular in some school districts around here). This was purportely done so that schools would not have to run A/C in the hottest month of the year.

I'm actually all for the year round setting. If the school days could be a little less rigid, reincorporating some of the stuff that has been done away with in light of NCLB, like art, music, longer recess, etc. I think it would benefit everyone.

Luckily the schools my son will be attending still have all the frills - lots of recess time, plenty of enriching activities. It's why we moved here (and why we pay a lot of school taxes) but it's worth it.

As far as year round school affecting working parents ... I'm sure the day care industry would adjust quickly!

[Julie]

I haven't read the comments yet, so I apologize if I am repeating what anyone has said. I have taught in California for the last 10+ years in the public school system. We are required to be in school for a certain number of days per year, and I'm sure it's the same in pretty much any other state out there. We start the first Weds. after Labor Day and finish up the last week in June. My district is a traditional calendar. I just deleted a bunch on multi-track and single-track year-round schooling b/c this was just too long. If you would like to know about that, let me know.

I agree that August feels very early to be starting school - especially for those of us who remember wonderful, endless days of summer vacation spent at the beach, community pool, in friends' backyards playing on the slip n' slide, or going to summer camp in the mountains. But the reality is that not all kids have these opportunities, and US students spend fewer days in school than any other competetive nations out there - and we have the achievement scores to prove it.

What's much more concerning to me as an educator of elementary school age kids is the fact that in CA and other states they are eliminating physical education from the program, or reducing it due to lack of funding. It used to be that there were credentialed PE teachers who would teach PE to every student every single day. Now many districts in CA are asking elementary school teachers to teach PE in addition to everything else. This translates to kids playing handball or roaming around the yard b/c classroom teachers are not equipped/trained/motivated to do more. PE teachers teach the rules to baseball, kickball, hockey, basketball, sportsmanship....YES, classroom teachers can do this, and many do. But I can tell you honestly that most that I know of DON'T. I'm not sure I would either if we didn't have PE coaches still funded in our district. And let's not even start in on recesses. Or art. Or music. Or dance. I could go on, but you get the picture.

I'm okay with the school year starting earlier, but I have serious questions about how that time in the classrooms and at school is spent. I'm not okay with the lack of importance placed on physical movement for young children. Asking kids to sit still for 6 hours a day is an impossible feat, and quite frankly completely unnatural to what they are hard-wired to be. Schools are still designed around a principle that is over 100 years old, and they have changed very little since then. Simply being in school for longer doesn't equate to higher achievement. Schools and teachers have to change what and HOW they are teaching - problems solving, critical thinking, project-based learning - in order to create kids who are achieving.

Sorry, I'll get off my soapbox now.

[Julia]

One of my friends is moving to Hawaii, and the school there started July 30. They have a six week summer break, with longer breaks during the year.

Schoools around here (Alabama) started in some districts last week. In the Birmingham metro area, there are so many school districts, and they all start at different times. Some started last week, some start this week, and some next week.

Generally there are fall breaks and a full week off for Thanksgiving break, plus a few weeks at Christmas. A week at spring break. Kids are out of school by Memorial Day, usually the Thursday before Memorial Day. Since we’d all rather be OUT of school once it starts, I’d rather be finished than still going once summer starts. By now, everyone has run out of things to do and we’re all hot and ready to see our friends, so we may as well start back to school.

A friend of mine is a lobbyist for the summer camp association. They are, as you can imagine, fighting the shortening of schools tooth and nail. It cuts into their bottom line.

One of the explanations for why we go back early and get out early is that the schools are all air conditioned, but people’s homes aren’t, and when it’s 100+ out, getting kids in the cool is important. Plus for kids on government assistance, they want to make sure they are eating, especially once it gets so hot.

My friends who are teachers HATE the shortened summer, but not for the reason most have mentioned. Brain Rot isn’t a concern of theirs, but having a summer job IS. They need it because we don’t pay teachers enough, and they would get jobs at summer camps or whereever. Now, they can’t.

When I was growing up, before lots of extended breaks and massive testing, we started the Wednesday after Labor Day and finished the Wednesday before Memorial Weekend. I think if my child has to go to school in June, I will cry. It’s summer! Time to go to the lake and the beach!

[sally]

So. Am I the only person here who absolutely hated camp? Day camp, sleep-away camp, I tried them all. And bah humbug.

Summer as a whole was just dandy, but camp was the pits. School looked good by comparison.

[AmyinMotown]

Camp does seem to be an East Coast thing, at least WRT to it being a rite of passage of childhood. We went to day camp but unless you were in Scouts it was pretty uncommon to go to sleepaway camp. I did go to journalism camp in high school because I was COOL.

Also, I HATED the beginning part of school each year because all the review was so boring! Plus we moved a lot, so there was a lot of anxiety if my new school was aligned differently and did different things at different times.

[Nell]

I'd rather see a model closer to year-round school, as in Japan and other parts of Asia, but with somewhat longer breaks as others have suggested above. I also like the model used in some Montessori and Waldorf schools, in which the morning seems to be devoted to more "academic" kinds of learning, and the afternoon set aside for gardening, crafts, outdoor activities and art. Obviously, such a model would only be possible in public schools if we -- as a society -- decide to value education appropriately. But a girl can dream ...

[Monica]

Well, I grew up on the east coast and never went to camp--we couldn't afford it. I was lucky in that I had much older sibs who were able to watch me (i.e. take me to the library and park me there) while my parents were both at work.

One question I have about the whole year model is: what do parents do during those more-frequent breaks? Camps more often? Nannies? Babysitting? It seems like that kind of program would depend on having a parent with a more flexible schedule or a SAHP.

My daughter will be doing the Montessori thing for preschool, but I am already growing concerned about these comments regarding the loss of recess and the "teaching to the test". Hope things start to change in, oh, 3 years. *sigh*

[Melissa]

Just wanted to chime in with something I read in "What's Going On In There?" which is a great book about brain development - I may have actually read it based on a recommendation here, can't quite remember. Anyway, there was a study showing that kids will generally lose IQ points over the summer. Then they will go back up during the school year when they are exercising their brains, as it were. So, a longer year with more but shorter breaks might have a lot of long term benefits while at the same time giving kids that important unstructured time as well.

[flea]

We have year-round schools here (NC) and there are school-based "camps" and assorted programs during the breaks. I believe they have to be paid for, but they make life possible for working parents.

As a lower-income parent, I am overjoyed that my about-to-be-4-year-old daughter is starting public school on Aug. 27. We have a local magnet school that is doing Montessori programming. My daughter will be in a mixed PreK-K class of 20 children. The school year for this school is traditional, and ends in early June. I went with this school since it saves me many thousands of dollars in child care, is 2 blocks from my house, and has a good program, but if we're still living here next year I will look carefully at the slightly farther away charter school with a year-round schedule (and a reportedly excellent program, too).

Sometimes I think that if everyone who homeschooled their children or put them in private schools because of concerns about the public schools got together and used their collective clout, we could have a wonderful public education system in this country.

As a child, I hated summers, which were mostly spent at my father's house, 2 states away from anyone I knew, no friends, bored bored bored and shuttled off into day camps because my stepmother had too many kids to deal with and I was the oldest and kind of a pain in the ass. I would much rather have been in year-round school.