Reader call: Spacing children

I've gotten a bunch of requests to talk about spacing children. Before we start, I want to say that I think this is a relatively unimportant topic because a) it's an incredible luxury to be able to choose how far apart you want your children to be, and b) any spacing will work out well if the parents make an effort to facilitate understanding between siblings (and, conversely, any spacing will suck if the parents increase the competition between the kids).

Also, I'm not going to argue for any spacing being best, because all I have is my own experience to draw on. That's what you guys are for, is to give a whole bunch of data points. All I can do is tell you what worked for me and why I chose it.

My brother and I are three years apart (I'm older, quelle surprise) and I always felt like it was a great distance. We were far enough apart not to be on top of each other, but close enough to play together easily. I didn't think I could handle kids two years apart or closer, so I tried for three years, and my own two are 3 years, 2 months apart. I'm very happy with the spacing (although, really, are there that many people who are unhappy with the spacing for their kids for more than just the first 6-12 months?), but here are the things I learned:

1. At that point it was already too late, but when my older son was 2 1/2 I had this feeling that he and I could both have handled it easily if another baby showed up right then.

2. One thing that was amazing about having an already-three-year-old and a newborn was that when I needed to nurse the baby down, I could stick the three-year-old in front of a Bob the Builder episode and know he'd stay glued to it like a younger child wouldn't. That was a lifesaver for the first six months.

3. A three-year-old was verbal enough to tell me what was bothering him emotionally and logistically.

4. If I'd had my kids 18 months apart I would have gotten the excruciating 18-month and three-year-old stages over with at the same time, instead of dragging out the angst.

5. My two started playing together constantly from the time the little one was nine months old or so. But so did the kids of my friends who had their kids four years apart.

So you can see that there are benefits to all sorts of spacings, and you'll always second-guess, even just a little.

Now you play. What did you do? What worked for you? What worked or didn't with your own siblings, if any? What would you like to do? What do you wish you had done? What role do you thing parental stress level and mindfulness has on the equation?

Comments

[Kelly]

Wow, this is timely. My only child is 8 months and my husband and I decided to start, well, not trying but not preventing, because both my mom and maternal grandmother had hysderectomies in their very early 30s, and I'm 29. It's very unlikely, but last night I started wondering if I could possibly be pregnant, and it was an overwhelming thought. I can't wait to read all the responses. My MIL has 5 kids and swears 2 years apart is the best. Her first and second were 14 months apart, second and third were 18 months apart. I can't even imagine!

[Slim]

I had a lot of theories about spacing before I plunged into miscarriages and secondary infertility (which was successfully treated). Now I, like Moxie, think that whatever happens, your kids will work it out.
I, however, am pretty sad that I have had my last baby, not because I want more than we have but because I like pretty much all the stages of growing up and am sorry to be done with the early ones. So if I were queen of my uterus and could make things happen at will, I would go for at least three years between kids, just so I could extend the process as much as possible. But that's about me.

[Jo-Ann]

If I had chosen spacing for my kids I would of chosen 3 years. Mine are 21 months apart. It was tough balancing the needs of 2 babies. Now that they are almost 2 and almost 4 they are really good buddies. I feel like having them so close together made my family building years melt away in an instant.

[Katy]

I am expecting my second sometime this month, and my first is almost 18 months. I wanted at least my first two to be fairly close in age, partly because I'm now 36 and definitely want 3 if not 4 kids, so I feel like I don't have the luxury of time.

I obviously haven't experienced actually having the two kids here yet, but I will say that being big and pregnant with a 15 to 18 month old is pretty difficult. My son takes a lot of energy, and so does this pregnancy - I feel like I'm exhausted nearly all the time. But I'm expecting/hoping it will get a lot better when the younger one is old enough that they can be buddies - I have had quite a few people tell me they really liked having a spacing of around 18 months, though the pregnancy and first 6-12 months of the second baby were difficult.

[flea]

I see some interesting spacing choices trends (among those with the luxury of choice) between my SAHM friends and WOHM friends - the former tend to have kids 2 years apart or even fewer (18 months apart - on purpose! I faint!), and the latter wait 3 years or more to have subsequent kids. From my (WOHM) perspective, the wait is partly because of the cost of child care, and partly because of the feeling of being so scattered anyway that adding a baby to the mix before the first child is fairly verbal and independent is terrifying. (Another issue for me personally was extended breastfeeding; I was not interested in tandem nursing but did want to nurse my first until she was 2 if she wanted that. I also was not fertile until she was 16 months old.)

My two kids are 2 years 11 months apart, and it's been pretty good (they are 10 months and coming up on 4 right now). We are having a difficult phase of older-sibling jealousy at the moment, as the baby has gotten very mobile and INTO SISTER'S STUFF, but at the same time we see more active playing together. I would love to see a post from Moxie addressing sibling jealousy issues, at what ages/phases it is likely to pop up, and coping strategies!

I am the oldest of 3, all 3 years apart (we were all born in the same week - my parents were very regular!). So 3 years feels like the "right" spacing to me. If we have a third, I could wait until #2 is 3 and still only be 36 when #3 is born, so my age is only a minor worry.

[LauraC]

I have fraternal boys that are spaced one minute apart.

After making it through the first (extremely difficult) 6 months, I wouldn't have it any other way. What I've learned from talking to a lot of different moms is that no matter when you have the second child, you learn to adapt and then you learn to love your situation. You learn the logistics and you learn how to make things work.

[oldest of four]

I love all my siblings, but I have always felt that I have the best, most cherished relationship with my younger brother, who was born when I was ten. we've always been able to play together and I feel like experiencing his babyhood from a more mature perspective really made me adore and appreciate him. the only downside is that he was just seven when I moved out, but I always made a special effort to keep in touch with him.

my parents also liked the ten-year age gap between us because they got lots of free babysitting out of it (and we older children were pretty self-sufficient the rest of the time).

[Menita]

My kids are 14 months apart. I had absolutely no say in this - my daughter was the product of years of infertility treatments and loss, my son was a complete surprise. I feel blessed every single day to have them both, and I find them hilarious and adorable.
That said, the last three months of my pregnancy and first three months after #2 were born were very hard. The last three months of pregnancy because to all intents and purposes my daughter was still very much a baby and could not understand why mommy could not pick her up as much/was so tired, etc. The first three months after my son was born were tough because...well,, my son was a newborn. Months 3-6 were better but still very hard. Then something magical happened and things got so easy it's almost ridiculous.
My greatest joy is seeing how much these two adore each other, and how much they take care of each other. It's also cool because they are going through stages one right after the other, and they are not so far apart in age that the little one can't follow his sister.
I am so in love with these kids.

[Jill]

My daughter had just turned 5 when my son was born. She is now 6 (and a half, can't forget that!), and he is almost 20 months.

For us, this has been just about perfect. We had lots of time to focus on her, and now, we are able to focus on him. She has her own little social life with school and neighborhood friends, and lots of activities to keep her busy, from barbies to books.

They play together wonderfully, and there have been no issues with jealousy. She is a little mom to him, or tries to be - we won't let her too much. As others have said, I think being a WOHM makes a difference for me. I don't think I could have handled a baby and a toddler. Now, if we're in a store or parking lot or wherever, I can count on her to stay with me and I can keep a close watch on him, since he's just as likely to run out into traffic as not.

Our spacing wasn't exactly intentional; that's just when both pregnancies occurred for whatever reason. But I'm glad it worked out the way it did, because it works well for our particular family.

[Amy F]

My boys are 2 years and 4 days apart (ages 3 and 14 months now) and I'm still waiting for it to get easier. Big Brother spends his days pounding his brother into the ground, which admittedly Little Brother thinks is hilarious about 1/3 of the time, which doesn't help explain to Big Bro why it isn't okay the rest of the time. Husband and I end up keeping the boys in separate rooms for much of the evenings and weekends because they both play fabulously one-on-one with an adult, but then I don't spend much time with my husband. We've been lucky to get pregnant immediately after deciding that we wouldn't prevent a pregnancy twice, and right now, the thought of getting pregnant again before Little Bro is three scares me silly. I'd like these two to get old enough to play together reasonably well before I'm sick and exhausted for a pregnancy or dealing with a tiny baby.

[Abby]

I have 2 boys who are 23 months apart, and am expecting my 3rd within the next few weeks.

For me, spacing of my 1st 2 primarily had to do with breastfeeding. I felt very strongly that I wanted each child to have the entire 1st year to breastfeed without any chance of weaning or supply issues. Since it took us awhile to get pregnant that first time, we figured we'd start out on the early side with #2 and started trying on our 1st son's 1st birthday. Low and behold without even getting a period, I was pregnant within 2 months.

The spacing has been mostly great, and I love that my boys play together, but I will admit that I think a bit more time might have been nice. Now that we're expecting another, I'm really digging how much more I can expect of my younger son in regards to this pregnancy and my own level of ability to parent. Between 2 and 3 will be about 2 1/2 years, so that feels much more managable to me now, than 23 months.

I will say though that from my view, I would rather have my kids closer together (less than 3 years idealy) for 2 reasons. 1. I love the fact that they are really able to play with each other and that their interests are quite similar (in terms of toys and tv and such) 2. I don't want to stretch this time period out forever. I love for the most part being pregnant and I love newborns, but I don't want to be dealing with sleep deprevation and diapers for the rest of my life, so I feel like we'll have a crazy few years and then move on to other things

[Bobbi]

Well, I can honestly say that while the difficult aspects change depending on the spacing, it all works out - it's kind of like the "how do you negotiate everything you have to do to get everyone out of the house in the morning" connundrum...it all just works itself out somehow without you thinking about it too much.

That said, I have 4 kids. There are 23 months between my first 2, then a 4 year gap, and 18.5 months between my last 2. My eldest daughter will be 8 in August, my next (son) will be 6 in July, next (daughter) will be 2 in August, and I have a 3 month old. I think just focusing on spacing, the 4 year gap was ideal for ease of dealing with a pregnancy and subsequent new baby. The oldest 3 play pretty well together, when the oldest 2 aren't fighting (which seems like all the time). I highly recommend "Siblings Without Rivalry" - I am making some progress in that area.

I think a lot of how easy it is though obviously depends on the personalities of the kids involved - my second was the crankiest baby ever, which made dealing with a 2-year-old a nightmare. My last 2 are the easiest babies around, which makes the 18 month gap not seem so horrible (I was TERRIFIED - my last was not planned...). But it has all worked out pretty smoothly. I've always said that going from 1 kid to 2 is incredibly difficult, but adding more after that is no big deal. Maybe it is just because of the personalities of my kids in particular, but I've heard that from other parents as well.

[Mandy]

Once upon a time, in the days before infertility, our plan was two kids, approximately 2 years apart - I wanted to get pregnant as soon after the wedding as possible (we'd already been together for 5 years).

Anyway...My daughter will be 2 months shy of her third birthday when her little brother or sister is born. Now that I'm pregnant and we're looking at the timing, I think it's a good thing. She's very vocal, but going through a pretty needy phase right now and I'm glad there isn't a newborn in the house at the moment. Not that we wouldn't make it work, but it would be difficult right now. I think when she's closer to her third birthday a few things will be easier, and she loves to help which should be an advantage for all.

Then again, everyone keeps talking about how terrible three will be.

My brother and sister (twins) are 6 years younger than me, a distance I didn't like most of the time. They had a special connection as twins, and as the oldest I was often put in the role of caregiver and when kids are young they sometimes resent that. We rarely had a lot in common at the same time and I feel I missed a lot when I went away to college, despite trying to stay in touch.

[Cathy]

I think a corollary topic would be: at what age do you start having children, as there is probably no perfect age or no age when you are "old enough" - my stepson, who lives with us, was born when my husband was 22 or so, and I never quite feel "old enough" for the challenges he presents. I'm not sure if I feel old enough for my daughter because it's not new anymore or if it's because I was so much older when I had her.

That said, my sister and I are just shy of 13 months apart (12 mo. 3 wks) and I suspect my mother's story would be much like Menita's.

My stepson is 13, my daughter is 4 and I'm expecting a new baby. 9 years was a distance that works too - my stepson was one of the first people to be able to make my daughter smile consistently, and he was always pretty helpful with being the one "in charge" of the back seat. I think he remebers being an only child pretty fondly, though.

When the baby is born the others will be 5 and 14. My daughter is so looking forward to being a big sister. Part of our spacing decision was budgetary - we were paying for daycare for both my daughter and my MIL, who has Alzheimer's, and taking care of her was pretty taxing too. And my daughter is quite the firecracker. Once our household was back down to just the four of us, I really wanted some time like that before adding another person to the mix.

[Jan]

My kids are 18 months apart. The very beginning was tough. Our daugheter's 18-month sleep regression (which took us completely by surprise) and son's 6-week totally cranky hold-me-every-second period happened concurrently. Also she was verbal really early, but even another 3 months would have made it much easier for us to talk to (warn) our daughter about what was going to happen. She's particularly prone to separation anxiety from me and my 3-day hospital stay (scheduled c-section) was probably harder on her than any other aspect of the whole thing. A lot of kids go through a resurgence of separation anxiety around 18 months, so I felt like the timing was tricky because of that. There were several months when she required more physical attention than her nursing infant brother.

That said, there's something to be said for getting started on the second adventure before you've been completely released from the first one. If we'd waited 3 years, we'd have had to go BACK to changing diapers, instead of having it extended. And night waking. And unexplained crying. Psychologically I felt like it was easier to just add to that burden a little (really, what's the difference if you've got one crying 'for no reason' or two?)

Now that they're 3 and 1 1/2, we're really getting to see what fun they're going to have together. I think for the kids it's going to be great for them to be so close together. They are very very different little people, though; I can see where if their strengths were similar or if they were the same gender, it might be tough being the younger one. I have a workmate with (adult) girls 19 months apart and she told me all kinds of horror stories about how socially ill-adjusted the younger one was and how she doesn't think she ever recovered from being in her older sister's shadow growing up.

My brother and I are 8 years apart. In many ways this was great. I thoroughly enjoyed him as a baby and was quite the little caregiver. I was also the most sought-after babysitter on the block in junior high and high school! Apart from a brief period when he was five-ish (when I swore I was NEVER having children, lest I be saddled with one like THAT) and when he was in his "screw everyone; I just want to have a good time" phase (late-teens/early 20s) just as I was becoming a really responsible grownup, he and I have gotten along famously. I was lonely as a kid, though, and would have loved having a sibling close to my age.

My experience is that everybody always says that what they did is the best. :)

[cagey]

My son is 19 months old and Kid #2 is looming on the horizon (give or take 5 weeks. Eek.)

I never thought I would be having children 20 months apart! While I am a little nervous about it, I know in the long run everything will work out. If the worst thing that happens to my son is that we had the audacity to subject him to a new baby sister, then he's one pretty lucky kid!

I am glad I am having my children close together. I am 5, 15, 17 years older than my 3 siblings. Our varying degrees of closeness have waxed and waned over the years according to which particular "lifestage" each of us is in. I am closest to the "5 years apart" sister, but that didn't start happening until I left for college.

Overall, I don't think there is a "best" as far as spacing goes. There seems to be pros and cons with ALL the varieties of spacing. For example, with my 19 month old, there is absolutely NO way that I can prepare him for a new sister. He just doesn't get it. However, I am hearing that kids at this age adjust fairly well to a new sibling because they really don't know any difference. I can tell you as a 5 year old, I KNEW the difference between having a new sister and being an only child. I was shoved to the side in lieu of my newborn sister and it stung. For years, my feelings were hurt at every turn because I remembered how it was to be an only child.

I can't wait to read the rest of the comments!

[Lisa V]

My children are 15.5, 13,9, and 5. The hardest spacing is the 4 years between the 13 year old and the 9 year old. There are things that the two oldest are ready to do, that the nine year old just wasn't. It's been this way since she was born. It meant as parents we had to divide and had to really look for things to do as a family that accomodated the wide range of ages.

For awhile after the fourth came, I was overwhelmed with four children. I know, well duh. But I really think alot of it had to do with the spacing. If I had to do it over again, and had 4 children, I would have them every two or 2.5 years. I think it would be really hard for a couple of years while they were little, but in terms of lifetime harmony, I think it's best.

My older daughters are sometimes friends and have the same interests, while my younger children will likely have to wait for adulthood to experience that with their siblings.

I was 4 years apart from my sister and didn't like it, and always envied my friends that had siblings closer in age. That was my plan, but it doesn't always work out according to plan.

[jessica]

My sister is 13 months older than me and growing up like that was awful.

I don't think it was the age thing as much as unskillful parenting though.

[Amanda]

I also think you're right - there is no such thing as perfect spacing. My kids are 2 yrs, 7 months apart and I would actually NOT do that again. Not that there's anything wrong with their age difference, because I'm really enjoying how they play so well now at 1 and almost 4.

But being pregnant with a two year old knocked me on my ass. My firstborn was/is a physically demanding child and he started to test limits at age two. Two year olds don't respond to verbal commands (or at least mine didn't), which meant I had to get up off the couch to discipline him. I was tired and braxton-hicksing all the time and that meant I let a lot slide during a critical age for his development.

If I can convince my husband to have a third, I'll probably wait until my second is four.

[alecia]

My boys are 19 months apart (2 year old and a 6mo. old now). I got pregnant w/the older one from a fresh IVF cycle. The younger one was conceived w/a frozen embryo transfer w/the embryos left over from the 1st IVF. We had a lot of discussions about spacing, but after realizing we had some serious fertility problems, we just went for it.

I wasn't sure if I wanted to do another fresh IVF cycle ever again so we decided to try the FET and if that didn't work to decide if we were going to accept having only 1 child (while also throwing any birth control away just in case there was one good egg/sperm combo left) or do another IVF.

We also factored in my age (31 at the time, 32 now), job issues (I'm finishing a master's degree and want to make a career change), and $$/insurance coverage for the fertility treatments (my current job's plan covers 80% of 3 IVF attempts, 99% of other plans, including my husband's, don't cover IVF at all in our state) as well as our willingness to hang on to the baby gear and go back to the newborn stage down the road. It seemed like there was a now-or-never push for us if we wanted to potentially add to our family.

All of that said, I'm not sure either of us actually expected the FET to work - it's generally a pretty low success rate (something like 20% or lower) and we had transferred the best embryos the first time around. It was a huge shock when I turned out to actually be pregnant.

As a couple of people already said, the hardest part so far was the end of my pregnancy and the first 2 months or so after the baby was born. We were really lucky to have a great sleeper for our 2nd baby and it was actually our toddler who was waking up in the night (wicked cold, 18-mo sleep regression, big life changes, Christmas holidays, family staying w/us, you name it) while the newborn slept peacefully. I had a fairly easy vaginal birth and a mostly uncomplicated recovery - I imagine that having a c-section and not being able to lift the toddler might have been a lot more difficult.

We are looking forward to the days when they can play together. Right now we have to be very very vigilant when they are on the floor together. The toddler sometimes tries to help the baby roll over, once resulting in a pinned arm and frantic shrieking in pain from the baby (I literally took my eyes off them for a moment and was in the same room at the time). The toddler is also pushing a lot of boundaries right now, especially w/hitting. We are trying to be firm but calm and not allow him to hit anyone, especially the baby, but it's a day-to-day struggle. His behavior is much better when he's well-rested and the household is calm. It gets worse when he's tired or when there's chaos (i.e., we're all trying to get ready to leave for a big outing).

We just moved the baby out of his infant car seat and it's been a huge relief to me. I know some people love to keep them in there as long as possible, but I hated it once he was over 10 pounds and I find it much easier to just deal w/the baby and not the giant car seat.

[anonymous]

I had a sister 3 3/4 years older than me. We played a lot (mom kept us to a minimum of television and often we only had each other) but we also fought a lot. She is a very independent person who didn't really like family functions so I felt like we really didn't start to get close until she left home for college. She seemed much happier once she was in control of her own life.

My husband has three kids with three different women (myself included in that). My stepsons are 19 and 12 and my baby girl is 10 months. Though the boys were 7 years apart they played together and are very close. (All the families are close - its a wonderful situation).

The baby doesn't really know the 19 year old (he left for college when she was a month old) but he makes an effort to hold her/play with her whenever he comes home to visit (about once a month). I'm hoping he gets to spend a lot of time with her this summer.

However, she absolutely WORSHIPS the 12 year old. He is with us one week and with his mom the next (she lives a mile away) so when he comes to our house at the beginning of his week with us we're practically dog turds to her for the first half hour he's there. After that we're okay I guess but no one can get a smile or laugh out of her like he can. And thankfully he loves the attention, loves being special to her, loves to show her off to his friends. He's not into diaper changing unfortunately, but can't say I blame him. He's going to be the BEST babysitter when she's potty trained.

My point? Moxie said it all at the beginning - it really doesn't matter when you have your kids as long as you are an attentive and loving parent. Your kids will fight and they will also play together. Alliances will be drawn and broken repeatedly. They'll have good memories and maybe some bad ones but really the spacing of kids is not about the kids, it's about you and where you are at in your life that you can manage it all.

I'd love to have another but at 39 my husband (who is stay at home dad with this 3rd child while I am WOHM) is done with sleepless nights (he's been a fully attentive dad since he was about 20!).

[elizabeth]

I too am the oldest which is really not a surprise if you knew me. My sister and I are about 3 and a half years apart which as the oldest was not ideal when we were in our teens. She was such a tag along that it drove me crazy. My father remarried and had children with my stepmother and I have a brother who is 11 years younger than me and a sister who is 12 years younger than me (they are 11 yes eleven months apart). I have a great relationship with all of my siblings particularly my youngest sister. Each sibling is a godparent to one of my children.

I have 3 kids. Two boys aged 10 and 9 who are 13 months apart and a 5 month old baby girl. The boys' 13 month difference in age is a good/bad but mostly good. Yes admittedly it was crazy in the first few months. For example, watching your 13 month old "walk" around and fall and you not being there to catch him because you're busy nursing. But afterward it got easier and the best thing is they have each other always. Neither can remember a time without the other one. They're good friends and good enemies because of course there is sibling rivalry and competition. I don't think they would have it any other way. Well most of the time anyway. We have always enjoyed how close they are and how they will always have each other and no play date is needed for that.

Enter the baby girl. I cannot tell you how absolutely adorable both boys are with their little sister. The age difference is perfect. They dote on her, they help me with her and they will know when they are older and thinking of marriage and children what it is really like to have a baby. I hope they have an appreciation of the hard work involved and the tremendous reward. Having the baby has made them focus on their own babyhood which is pretty darn cute. Questions like what was my first word, when did I first crawl are ones they would probably not normally ask and we enjoy telling them the stories. I have to say there is not much sweeter than seeing your 10 year old sleeping with his baby sister asleep in his arms or watching your 9 year old try to make her smile and laugh. I wouldn't change the age differences for anything.

[Rachel]

My husband and I are expecting our first baby in July, so all I have is planning and observation to add. We would like to have at least 4 kids, but having had one miscarriage already, and being an only child because my parents had several miscarriages after me, I'm leery of thinking that we can really plan it out. I've been mulling over what seems to be the two different approaches to child-spacing in our community. Large families are the norm in our society, but among people I know the spacing ranges from having 7 kids over 21 years, every 3 years exactly, to a lot of kids in a short time (5 in 8 years, for example). There seems to be two very distinct schools of thought: the first is to have all the kids close together and just go through several years of very intense parenting, with the mother taking a hiatus from her career. The second is to space the kids every 2-3+ years, with the mom taking maternity leave with each baby, and all the other kids in school or day care. I know people who have a certain number in mind, and are ok with having two or even three kids in diapers until they get there. I also know couples who are both working part-to-full time and having kids every 3+ years.

We really haven't figured out exactly what we'd like to do (that's assuming we're in control of our fertility, which feels like a big "if"), and probably won't for a while, but we won't be trying for anything less than an 18 month gap with the first 2. My husband is the oldest of 6, all born within 12 or 13 years. He grew up with diaper changes and tantrums and playing with babies, so I think he's a little more prepared for this baby than I am. I'm not sure if any of his siblings are even 3 years apart in age (the closest are 14 or 15 months, and that was unplanned), and while they all seem to remember a certain degree of chaos growing up, the closeness they have is amazing. My mother-in-law managed to get her bachelor's and master's degrees during all these pregnancies and babies, and went to work full-time when the youngest was 2. Now she has a great career, my father-in-law works less, and they're doing a lot of traveling without their kids. They got married when she was 18 (!) and he was 20 (!), so they're not even 50 and already have several grandkids.

So, I think I tend toward the bunch-of-kids-at-once style, but we'll just have to see how it all goes.

[hedra]

Back when I was in college, my best friend reported a professor of child development (one of her profs) saying that while any spacing CAN work, the ones that fail the most spectacularly (including violence) are when the spacing is 18 months to 2 1/2 years. He speculated that this was because of the intense need of this age (the older child) for parental attention and management RIGHT when the parents have to take care of a very needy newborn... and the divided attention/attention loss can be very difficult for the parents to manage properly at that age (preverbal or poorly verbal, emotionally uncontrolled, and several fussy stages in a row - 18 months, 20-22 months, etc., etc.). Earlier, the needs are high, but the cognition isn't advanced enough to establish blame effectively (that is, 'whose fault that I don't have mommy's attention?' - younger and older than that span tend to blame MOM, not their sibling, LOL!).

And honestly, the only person I know who actually tried to kill their younger sibling (literally) was exactly 2 years older than him. (Fortunately didn't succeed, but the parents failed to manage the rest of the relationship, and they pretty much hated each other until the younger was in his 30's.)

So, going into having kids, I tracked back from the oldest I'd like to be pregnant, and put in 2 1/2 - 3 year gaps, and padded it a little for 'time to achieve pregnancy', and ... then had to deal with reality. Our first two are 4 years apart. Miscarriages weren't in my mental plan, dangit. Four years was great, though. Some issues will come up later, I suspect - they're very very close now, but I think the dynamic will be challenging when one is a freshman in highschool and the other is away at college... There's an eagerness to be together, and a very clear awareness that they will be repeatedly separated by the structure of our school systems.

Second gap we aimed for 2.5 years due to my advancing age, and had more miscarriages, but did end up with twins 3 years after the second child. Three years is a good gap - they're close enough, and not too far apart. But there's more difficulty convincing the younger ones what separates their skills (more tendency to think they CAN do just what the older sib does, don't really see themselves as significantly younger).

Managing the relationship is a challenge at different points for each pattern, IMHO. If they're close in age (including twins+), it seems to me that early management is intensive, but later they have more natural functional peer-like relationships. Beyond that, it seems the pattern of when the relationship needs support varies wildly (and probably by personality as well). In the end, it is more about what skills we give them to manage the relationships THEMSELVES, and about who each child is as a person, than it is about the spacing. Certainly, in my MASSIVE family, who I've been close to has changed and changed as I was growing up, and then who I've remained close to as an adult has been different again. We were all mainly 2-2.5 years apart, and I'm closest now to the sister 5 years older than me, though we were only close as kids when I was in Kindergarten.

BTW, I like Siblings Without Rivalry as a basic book on how to help them manage the relationship themselves, by the way. WAY useful, even with younger kids, IMHO. Just changing how I said some things made the difference for my kids - there was a dramatic change from very typical acting out and being fakey-lovey with the new baby, to real affection and a lot of honesty (even of the 'man, babies are annoying!' type) with just a few words from me. WOO! The willingness to accept the negatives in the relationship really keeps things flowing, IMHO. I'm really proud of the response my oldest gave when I asked him what he thought it would be like to have a new baby sibling (back when we thought it would be just one): "Annoying. And cool. Just like having a little brother."

So, yeah, Moxie's got it. Anything can be worked out, lived through, managed and improved. Some gaps might be challenging at different points (with that 18-30 month time period having a serious challeng risk right after the baby arrives - though this obviously also varies by child and parents!). Keep working it, keep observing, watch for competition (even subtle), avoid comparisons, spend some time with each, really listen to what you're saying and check it for what they might hear that you DIDN'T mean to say, the usual advice... seems to work so far. Certainly teachers and people who observe my kids casually (friends of my mom's, for example) keep making a point to tell us that our kids clearly genuinely love and care for each other, even when they're not always happy about what the others are doing. That's my goal, and that, I think, can be accomplished at any age gap. The rest is just details.

[AmyinMotown]

Interesting and timely topic for me as well. My daughter turned 2.5 on Saturday. I was exactly 2.5 when my brother was born, and I always thought 3-ish years like that was ideal spacing. When we were kids, we were far enough apart in age that we could each "be ourselves" and not someone's sister or brother in school and were each going through milestones at different times. As aduts, it feels like we are very closein age and were going through many of the same tings at the same time (even got married within 6 weeks of each other; THAT was fun for my parents. And we're both raising small kids now). However, I am not the most fertile person on the planet and our efforts to conciee #2 have so far gone nowhere. Secondary IF has been worlds better than primary was for me emotionally, but I worry a lot about how old I will be (I turn 37 Wednesday) and if Maggie will have too far a gap between her and any future siblings that they won't be close.(May I note that I am super grateful that you mentioned it's a luxury to be even concerned with spacing children; for so many of us it's just not that easy).

One thing that's bugging me now and I can''t put my finger on why: Pretty much everyone I know who had a kid Maggie's age has a second one now. The vast majority of people I know, particularly over-30s, got pregnant again immediately and had 2 under 2. That was our plan, and I KNOW I was more fertile right after I stopped nursing, but I also knew when the time rolled around that there was NO WAY I could handle 2 under 2. I lack the patience, organizational skill and support network to deal with two kids so close together. My daughter is darling and wonderful but also a VERY challenging two year old and I can't imagine dealing with the bone-crushing fatigue of new motherhood and chasing her around. I was OK with that decision at the time, but find myself feeling regretful that I may have closed the door completely on another baby by waiting, even though I don't think I would have been a good mom to either child had I gotten pregnant before she was a year. A major factor in my worries right now is also the spacing of my husband's family. He is the youngest of 5--the first three are really close in age, the fourth is like 4 years younger, and his mom had a miscarriage between that brother and my husband, so he is 6 years younger than his next oldest brother and 10 years younger than the one before that. They could NOT be less close. They don't hate each other or anything, they are just not close, at ALL. Like I have never met one of his nieces, and several members of his family just met Maggie this Christmas. I worry that if they are too far apart they will have the same cordial, but distant relationship. However, I know sisters who are 5 years apart and as different as can be and seem very close. So, you never know. All I know is, if I could will myself to become pregnant I would be right now so we could have a three-ish year gap.

[Mary]

My girls are seven years apart, the older just turned nine and the baby is about to turn two. I had secondary infertility which lead to the seven year difference.

However, I remember thinking when the older girl was three and four years old, that even though she was a very "easy" child, she was still so needy that I was happy that we were able to give her all our attention.

She's been really great with her little sister and in a lot of ways it's been much easier to have a baby with the help of an older kid who can play with her and watch her while I take a shower or whatever. The baby hasn't always been that great with her big sister though, there's kind of a love/hate thing going on, lots of jealousy on the baby's part.

In theory, I'd like to have a third, but the two-year-old is still such a handful that I cannot imagine being pregnant anytime soon. So there would be at least a three year, if not a four year difference. However, I'm about to turn 38 and between my aging eggs, the secondary infertilty, DES exposure, two cerclages, and two dangerous births, I'm not sure we're meant to have a third. I feel like we would be really pushing our luck to even try. And then there's the car issue, we'd have to get a bigger car to fit three kids! Also, the nine-year-old has made it quite clear that we aren't allowed to have any more babies. She's done.

[hedra]

Oh, wanted to say that the research quoted by the prof may be total hooey, it just was part of my thinking when I was planning.

I can see it being a serious challenge, but hey, having ONE kid can be a challenge!

[Amber]

Oh no! What a bittersweet discussion this is for me. My son just hit the eight month mark a week ago, and I have been thinking non-stop about getting pregnant again.
I have been obsessed with pregnancy/parenthood for most of my young adult life, but a few years ago, I felt it became an actual, physical need. Seemed early for the old biological clock bit, but my mother had many reproductive issues at a very young age -- she was seventeen when she had me and didn't successfully carry another child until my brother was born when I was eight. I hated our age difference. HATED. I felt early on that I was his alternate mother as opposed to his sibling. We had a bizarre relationship for many years, and now we barely talk when we see each other. The point? God willing, I will not space my children more than a few years apart.
Well, there's the easy part. The hard part is, I want to have another one, like, tomorrow. I had an awesome pregnancy and birth experience, and I would swear on all that is holy that I am telling the truth about that. :) Like several other people above, I am also coming from the perspective of getting the "baby stuff" over with in one big, awkward, yes even painful lump. So to have a few years of diapers and super-stress, and then move on to the next level sounds good to me. (Crazy, maybe.)
Okay, wrapping this up. I think my husband would be happy if we just stuck with one child, so he's no help in the spacing debate. So does that mean it's up to me? And the comments all say different things, so now I am just as confused as ever!!! I don't want to rush into things because my body seems to be telling me "quick! quick!" on the off chance that it is not in fact my clock ticking, but rather a bizarre infatuation with being pregnant just for the sake of being pregnant...

[Charisse]

Hmm...well, I have a 3 year and and probably won't have another (though we haven't said never, we love our compact little family and just haven't felt the same kind of desire yet that we did for the first one).

I have a 2 1/2 years younger sister, and really disliked that spacing, though as Moxie says it probably had more to do with my parents' management of it than anything else. We were never close (never enemies, just extremely different) and still aren't...my parents chose to treat us as the same age in terms of privileges, bedtimes, etc. but as different ages in terms of responsibilities and caretaking. Don't do that. :)

I always thought I'd have 2 kids but space them 3-5 years apart. Could still happen...but one three year old is great, and with my husband and father as examples of happy only children (and myself, as I said, an only-neutral sibling) I don't feel my daughter would be harmed by onlyhood. We're just listening to our hearts for another while to see if we hear another child. Glad to hear from the folks with more separated kids--it's interesting data!

[Lisa]

We only have the one (16 mos.), and that may be it for us - I'm 39 and want 3 or 4 years between them if there is a second.

I suspect that for a lot of parents, as for us, it may have a lot to do with the first one's temperament - T. is bright and happy but classically "high-need" - lots of nursing and little napping, etc. etc. I'm just now getting to the point where I can, say, make a snack or answer an e-mail while he plays beside me for a few minutes. I feel like if we had another, I'd be shortchanging them both, especially if the second were as intense as his/her parents and brother. Then there's the issue of maternal sanity. :->

Luckily, both DH and I feel that if that means T. ends up an only child, that's fine, though I'm not saying "never."

[Anon]

My sister is 2 1/2 years younger than me and we have always been very close. My mother told me she was having another baby so I would have someone to play with, and I was thrilled as could be, apparently. (Although given the choice between brother, sister, and horsie I picked horsie).

My husband is 2 1/2 years younger than his sister, and not only were they never very close, his mother was afraid to leave them alone together for fear she would kill him. They get along now but are still not terribly close.

As an adult looking into having children I always wondered whether it was just our personalities, and my personality in particular that made it go well, or if it was good parenting. Reading this thread it sounds like it was probably good parenting. I don't know what my MIL did wrong (unintentionally) but it seems likely that there are things she could have done to get a better outcome.

[Kathleen]

You're so right, Moxie. To each his or her own !

i have a 14-month old daughter & we are trying for our second. We, personally, didn not want 2 under 2. The question of spacing showed up when we were debating when to start trying again. My MIL swears by the 21-month separation between her two sons, whereas i have 7 years with my sister & couldn't ask for a more wonderful relationship with her.

:)

[Kathleen]

You're so right, Moxie. To each his or her own !

i have a 14-month old daughter & we are trying for our second. We, personally, did not want 2 under 2. The question of spacing showed up when we were debating when to start trying again. My MIL swears by the 21-month separation between her two sons, whereas i have 7 years with my sister & couldn't ask for a more wonderful relationship with her.

:)

[Linda]

Personally, I have found 13 minutes to be perfect. :) I never would have wished for twins (most honest people wouldn't) and the first year~what I remember~was hellish. Once they started to walk and interact, it got a million times better. They are great friends and in a lot of ways, it's currently easier having 2 who entertain each other and are willing to play all those boring toddler games.

I am unexpectedly pregnant now and there will be a 3 year 3 month age difference between these kids. We'll see what that brings.

I will say that I'm closer to my 10 years older brother than my 7 years older sister, but I think that's mainly personality issues. Like most people are saying, any age gap can work and a lot of sibling closeness depends on parenting and the kids' temperments.

[Kate]

I never, ever wanted kids less than 2 years apart. I thought it was crazy (CRAZY!). Even 3 was pushing it, I thought. But I thought that more than 3 might be too far apart, blah blah.

Well, I got 22 months. And in retrospect, I'm glad I did, mostly because now I don't have to obsess over the "ideal" spacing. I am plugging along with what I've got. We're making it work.

Everyone's still in diapers (hopefully not for TOO much longer for the almost 3 year old), everyone wants to play with the same toys at the same time, and everyone melts down at around 7pm. But I foresee them having a great time together because they will be in similar stages. They'll overlap in the same preschool for a year, etc.

Frankly, with the way my daughter (the 3 yo) is now, I'd be very worried to bring in a newborn--she is very smart and very funny, but needs a lot of attention and interaction. Requests to play quietly in her room for a few minutes are met with a lot of protests. She is about 4000% more verbal than she was a year ago, but that doesn't make her any more rational, have any more common sense, or be any more accepting of delayed gratification.

Of course, as my husband says, there is no way to predict how she'd be if she were still an only child at this point in her life.

Now I guess the big question is more children or not, but we're not even going there until the little one is out of diapers, at a minimum. There's my mental health to consider. ;-)

[michele]

I am one of 5. We were all born from 63-68, so basically my mom had a kid a year.

My closest sister and I fought like cats through our teens. But on the whole, I think having us all be about a year apart has made us very close.

I didn't meet my husband until I was in my late 30s, so if we were to have children at all, we knew we would have them quickly.

I got pregnant easily with them both, luckily, and they are 18 mos. apart, with my youngest being born a month before I turned 40. There are pros and cons to having a 2.6 and a 1-year-old. Pros? What's changing 2 diapers if I am already changing one? I use handme down clothes, and cribs and everything else. All the baby handling I learned with the first came in handy with the second, and I had no time to get used to sleeping again before the second came along! And I will be home with the both of them until school, and then back to work part-time. I knew I would stay home for one, so why not 2? And 2 in daycare is just crazytalk expensive.

Cons? It's exhausting. It's stressful, dealing with the older's tantrums and the younger's clinginess. I only have 2 hands! Plus, there's no way the second can get the same amount of attention the first did, so you feel like you are shortchanging someone. I tend to shortchange the younger, since I think he won't remember, but I'll have to deal with it eventually.

So, all that said, even if I was younger when I started a family, I would have spaced them close.

[Carla Hinkle]

My mom was one of three girls, with 2.5 years between my mom and the middle one, and 14 months between the 2nd two.

I think the overall number of kids makes a difference as much as the spacing -- with only 2 kids, my mom and the next sister might have been close. As it was, the 2nd and 3rd girls got lumped together and my mom was more on her own. My aunt (the 3rd girl) does seem to have been strongly, and not that postively, affected by the 14 month age difference with the middle girl being a very type "A", go-getter personality.

My sister and I were 25 months apart, and it was just the 2 of us, and we fought a lot/played a lot -- we are quite close and I think it worked out great. My mom was not really planning on that spacing (it took her a year to get pregnant with me and only a month or two with my sister) but is happy it worked out.

My daughters are 2 years, 9 months apart. The baby is only 4 months so who knows what the future will hold, though purely from a managing perspective it has been great -- the 3 year old is not at all jealous of the baby and loves to help, and I can be paying attention to her just by talking or coloring while holding/nursing the baby. I am loving this spacing at the moment and would try for 2.5 years-plus if we go for a 3rd. (Though the 3 year old is firmly into the "terrible 3's" and that S-U-C-K-S, but I suspect it would no matter when we had the next baby!)

[RHW]

two boys, 13 months apart, now apprx 1.5 and 2.5 in age. I think 2yrs apart would've been much harder b/c of jealousy issues, etc. My older guy wasn't even walking when we brought his brother home. I would do again in a heartbeat - they do everything together. Seriously, EVERYTHING, and it's wonderful! We've been trying for #3 for quite some time... and I'm nervous b/c if I managed to get pregnant right now, the gap would be 2yrs 2mo which seems so enormous to me. My parents had 5 kids in 6 yrs, so I thrive in controlled chaos...

[Melissa]

My eldest has a heart defect and I decided to try again pretty soon for a sibling so that we would not have a small infant when he was due for another heart surgery. My boys are 21 months apart. It was hard at first, especially since my eldest was not walking because of a stroke he had when he was a baby. Having two non walkers was tough but my eldest learned to walk soon after his brother was born. It is so great to wee them playing together and being friends. We are waiting awhile for number three though but I think we will try and keep three and four pretty close in age too.

[Rebekah]

I feel stupid jumping in here, as I didn't at ALL get to choose when we had our second baby (two years of trying, miscarriages, etc.), but whatever ... I had originally wanted a 3-year gap between Aidan and our next child. Not too young, not too old. But their 5 year age difference has actually been great for our family. Aidan adores his little brother, was able to participate in my pregnancy and is very helpful with Ronan.

I wouldn't want that large of a gap between Ronan and (God willing) our next, though. I think it will probably be really, really hard for me to tackle, but I still would like to start trying for a third not long after Ronan turns one. I'm very ready for our family to be "complete" and for everything that is involved for me to get and stay pregnant to be a thing of the past forever. I don't know how I'll handle a toddler and a baby, but in my gut and in my heart I just have this feeling that it's what is supposed to happen for us. Weird, but I can't shake it. We'll see what happens!

[swimmermom]

I haven't read all the comments but this is a subject that I feel pretty strongly about so I'm going to jump in and hope I'm not lamely echoing 15 people above me.

Three years' spacing is the minimum I could handle. My 1st and 2nd are 3.5 years apart and 2nd and 3rd are a few weeks shy of 3 years apart. It has worked great for our family logistically, emotionally, in every way I can think. The next older child was fully potty trained, able to get drinks & snacks for himself, could play independently for awhile, etc. before the new baby arrived. I breastfeed for a long time so it was nice to have that experience fully with each child and still wean (well, mostly) before the next one arrived.

I feel that spacing our kids (I say that like we planned it, but ftmp it was accidental -- 2 miscarriages in between 1st and 2nd children) really allowed us to enjoy babyhood with each child. We'd had a break from diapers, so changing more diapers wasn't a hassle, it was a joy. It's like we got to recharge our batteries. And then we didn't rush our kids to grow up. When you have a new baby, an 18-month-old seems so huge and mature by comparison, but a child that age is really still a baby in many ways. It is so easy to expect them to shed the baby ways just because they seem so big but I don't think that's fair to them.

The World Health Organization has a saying, "Three to five saves lives" to encourage child spacing of 3-5 years. Longer spacing allows the mother to restore what the last pregnancy took out of her and have a healthier pregnancy and baby the next time. Even in the US where good food is available, many women are functionally malnourished because they get enough calories but not enough nutrition -- the EFAs and micronutrients for example, as well as vitamins. There is a good Q&A here about child spacing and how to go about restoring your reserves if you want children closer together: http://www.mothering.com/sections/experts/buckley-archive2.html#fourmonths

[Elizabeth]

Wow, thanks Moxie for posting this. I have a 2-yo (nearly 25 months) and am a little stressed out b/c on the one hand I am pretty terrified of being pregnant and having a small infant again, and being able to take care of my fairly-high needs dd at the same time...OTOH it seems everyone around me with a child my dd's age either has another kid already or is expecting one, and although peer pressure is not a good reason to have a child (obviously), I do hear a lot about the benefits of closer spacing - and lately I have been wondering if a farther spacing will shortchange the kids in terms of mommy's time - if they are not interested in the same activities, I can see that as a big provoker of jealousy.
But, reading through all these "data points" and thinking about my dd's personality and my own tolerance for chaos (very low)...it does seem more logical for us to put off having another. It kind of makes me sad to miss the "window" for dd having a sibling close to her age, and maybe it would even be great for her. But she is at a pretty demanding phase and I don't see that being over in a year, honestly. Maybe it's best to wait until she is 4 or 5 and a little more able to tolerate playing on her own while mommy takes care of a new baby.
Sigh, I don't know, I'm also assuming I could get pregnant right away. It took 7 months and Metformin treatment to get pregnant the first time and now I'm 3 years older and 20 lbs. fatter...who knows what the timeline of TTC will be.
Anyway, this has been very interesting to read.

[Meegan]

Timely post for me. My only daughter will be nine months old this week. Today, while picking her up from the childcare facility at my gym, I caught myself getting that "tug" as I looked at a 6 week-old. We've talked about trying again after her first birthday. (Actually one month after her first birthday, which allows Mommy and Daddy to take their first solo vacation, post-baby. I do not wish to be pg on this vacay. I wish to footloose, fancy-free and drinking champagne!) Anyway. My sister and I are 4 years apart. We've never been close. We did play together, occasionally, as children. But that ended pretty early as 4 years seemed to be a significant difference.

I'm really enjoying reading all these comments. Gives me some things to consider and discuss w/ the hubby.

[Dooneybug]

My son and #2 (due at the end of August) will be about 14 1/2 months apart. We had difficulty conceiving #1 so we decided to start early just in case we had issues again. We took the "we're not trying but we're not avoiding" tactic and figured if it took past #1's first birthday then we'd dive into the whole seriously trying again. Except there were no issues and it happened within the first month after my fertility returned. We were quite shocked but I look forward to them being close in age, going through similar stages together. My husband is already trying to convince me that we should try for #3 early on too, but I'm not biting on that at all. I'm at 27 weeks and was doing pretty good physically until right about now. The physical exhaustion has definitely hit me now, chasing around an almost one year old (in two days!) and being pregnant.

I have a brother who is 14 years younger than me. We will never have a typical brother/sister relationship because I am more of a parent role model to him than a sibling. Maybe one day when he's got his own family there might be more similarities that we can identify with one another on.

[MrsHaley]

In reading through the comments, I noticed no one addressed the gender implications of various spacing distances. Does anyone have a feeling about close vs. further spacing as it relates to sister-sister / brother-brother / brother-sister / sister-brother? From what I can tell, it looks like a lot of the people who had sibs close in age AND the same gender had more difficulty ... whereas a greater space or a gender difference made it easier. Does that sound right to anybody?

I am an only and the mother of an only, so I have NO EXPERIENCE and NO IDEA. FWIW, however, "only" is a good choice, too --I'm relatively unscathed!

[amy]

I feel I'm in a unique position here, plus MrsHaley's comment hit home, so I will weigh in.

First, my brother was eight years older than me. It seems that the comments from siblings in wider spreads were from the older sibling, particularly those who felt they ended up in a parental role. I can't speak to that, but I can say that I absolutely worshipped my brother, and although we weren't close while I was in elementary school, I loved having a "big" big brother.

Second, I have the (for lack of a better word) advantage of having been a sibling and an only child. My brother died when I was 15, so my whole adult life I've been the only. While I prefer having had a sibling, MrsHaley's right. "'Only' is a good choice, too." I'd love to have another one, but if it doesn't happen, I won't love the one I've got any less.

That said, I *do* want a sibling for my daughter (who is 3 today). I know that the early years will be tough, no matter the spread, but my hope is that there will be a payoff for them as adults.

[CathyY]

When our second child arrives, my daughter will be just shy of 3. When she was 2, my MIL actually said there was no point in having a second, as they'd be too far apart to be playmates. ??? Nooo, any closer and someone would have to commit me. I'm not there yet, but I think a 3 year spread is going to work well for us. I, personally, would be too overwhelmed with two closer in age and would feel like I'd missed some of my older child's babyhood. My sister and I are 3 years apart and that worked well. A lot of it is personalities, not age differences, IMO.

It's a good thing we don't have that much control over this or we'd all go mad with the options.

[Bobbi]

I'm glad Mrs. Haley brought up the gender thing - I was going to, but my comment was already way too long!

I'm curious to see what having opposite gender sibs within 2 years and same gender sibs 6 years apart (4 kids - girl, boy, girl then boy). My sis and I are 2 years apart and are close now but weren't growing up. There was too much competition going on...

[hedra]

Gender thing...

For my kids boy-4yrs-boy-3yrs-girl-5minutes-girl(twins). The boys are very close. The girls are very close. The boys are very close to the girls. The girls are very close to the boys. I had some concern that the oldest might be 'too far' from the twins to feel connected, but by chance/luck/act-of-God, they were born on his birthday, so there's an ongoing 'we're connected' loop already in place. The older two (boys, 4 year gap) play a bit more together than with their little sisters, but I think that is mainly a factor of current age of the twins (2.5, still breaking toys that belong to the older ones). That said, they do all play together regularly, and often, and their main 'competition' is who loves who most today. We do try to suppress the overt competition, but sometimes it sneaks in anyway.

As for me... my mom had boy, girl, girl, girl, boy, girl, boy. (oldest died at 3, and second was custodially with her father until 15 years old)... so that leaves girl, girl, boy, girl, boy for most of growing up.

When I was very small (toddler to preschooler), I was closest with oldest sister (almost 8 years older). Combattive with older brother (2.5 years), and pretty much ignored next older sister (5+ years).

When I was a preschooler-to-K, HORRIBLE envy and issues with next younger brother (though that was almost CERTAINLY parental issues, since my step-dad was into extreme favoritism of his ONLY SON, gah!). Adoration of the older brother, extreme adoration of the next older sister (which was tolerated to enjoyed at that age), pretty much blah on the oldest sister.

When I was 1-3rd grade or so, close to younger brother, somewhat competitive relationship with older brother (played together but with some push-back in both directions), hero worship of next older sister (who avoided me or tormented me by turns), and tormented/teased or ignored by oldest sister (who at that point I disliked).

4-6th grades, tormented younger brother mercilessly and was followed and worshipped by him in return. Older brother changed custody to his dad JUST as our relationship was evening out and developing some depth. Next older sister alternately sweetly engaged and kind, and totally dismissive and 'too old'. Next older sister suddenly much more interesting, all 'grown up' (ish) and suddenly kind and involved and respectful of me as a person. Also re-introduce oldest sister (11 year gap?) as an adult, very involved, used to take me for the day on weekends, hung out and had a great time.

As I got to be a pre-teen and teen, pretty much all of the relationships smoothed out (with minor spats and issues). After that, it was mainly personality and life issues that played roles. My oldest sister drifted away as she went through rough patches in her life, my middle older sister moved away, my closest older sister (age-wise) went through a nasty adolescence, older brother was still with his dad, younger brother was dealing with the entitlement-vs-disenfranchisment issues that came from the parenting fiasco (still working that out at 37, poor guy) and still feels that puts a distance between us that he can't cross. Closest to the second older sister, now - despite distance, we communicate at least weekly, and often daily. Don't do that with any of the others, though we all love each other.

So, gender? Age? Changes, at least for me.

With twins, there is at least solid research showing which end up with the closest relationships... identical girls have the strongest relationship, and fraternal girls and identical boys come next (though I can't recall in which order), with fraternal boys next, and fraternal boy/girl last. The boy-girl relationship has the least common bond function, the least 'glue' that holds over time and distance and life events. Hence I think the romaticism of 'having a brother' for a boy and 'having a sister' for a girl. But personality and parenting DO have a lot to do with it. Common interests, skills, abilities, and experiences play a role, IMHO, as well. And NONE of that is really within our control.

I've just finished reading 'Our Share of Night, Our Share of Morning: Parenting as a Spiritual Journey' ... and one of the points of the whole parenting journey seems to be simply in TAKING it. In being here, every day, and doing what we do. Another book (Everyday Blessings: The Inner Work of Mindful Parenting) delivers the same message in a different way with different purpose, but it really the same: Just do what you can, and experience what you get, stay with what IS.

It seems sometimes that the decisions we have to make about parenting are HUGE, and IMPORTANT. They are, of course. And at the same time, in some senses, they are not. Choose (should you be so lucky as to have that control) to have kids close together, and you will get the chance to experience that, handle the issues with that, deal with that day in, day out, up, down, good, bad, sorrows and joys. Choose instead to have kids far apart, and you get the same - the opportunity to rise to the challenges, blow it, catch up, rejoice, grieve, worry, celebrate.

I really like the spacing we have. I never wanted kids close together in age, not "too" close, anyway. And then I got twins. People ask twin parents 'how they survive/cope/do-it' and the answer is 'just like you would' - we rise to the challenges, and enjoy the unique gifts of having two five minutes apart in age, instead of three years. There are always opportunities for regret, for wishing we'd made a different choice, or for celebrating and congratulating ourselves on making a good choice - when we had choices at all. Both fretting and preening are, IMHO, relatively pointless. Use your heart and your head, assess what YOU enjoy and prefer, try for what makes sense medically/physically, socially, personally, financially... and then let go of the ownership of the choice. After the baby arrives (and indeed, before), whatever timing that ends up being, it is all just in the responding to what IS. Everything up to that point is ... well, maybe not immaterial, but not nearly as relevant as what you do after that.

[caro]

An observation and something to think about, not a criticism of the post or any of the comments:

I usually love to read the comments on this site, regardless of how immediately relevant they are for me, but I am struck by how very, very bored I am with all of the comments and theories on child spacing.

And I find my boredom with it so *interesting*!

Maybe the reason I have no interest in this is that we are well on our way to having a "full house" and it's all moot for us (and would be even if I weren't 7 months pregnant with #2, because my ovaries can't be counted on to comply with any sort of schedule). But more than that it just seems like there are so many variables to consider, it's almost impossible to compare experiences. Apparently everyone loves to talk about their own birth spacing experiences and put forth theories, but am I the only one whose eyes are going funny trying to read all this?

Really, really not trying to be a curmudgeon, just stunned at my own lack of interest...