Laura needs some post-toddler love

Laura writes:

"I’ve been reading (and posting) about surviving the toddler twos and threes. I’m in the middle of what feels like hell now, and would love to hear stories about when it ends. Does something miraculous happen at 4? Do toddlers suddenly learn a skill that improves life for everyone for a little while? Is 4 really that much better?

I heard plenty of, “Momma go away!” yesterday. It was a bittersweet Mother’s Day! I could use some encouragement."

Oh, poor Laura. I wasn't able to pay much attention to when the shift happens, because I had a newborn when my older son was going through the transition from 3 to 4 years old. I was just trying to keep my head above water dealing with two at a time. But I do know that my 5-year-old is amazingly easier to deal with now than he was when he was 3. Frankly, he's a delight. And I think msot 5-year-olds are a ton of fun.

Is there anyone out there who has a theory about when, exactly, it gets better (and "when the kid goes off to college" doesn't really count)?

Comments

[Kate]

I agree with Moxie.

My brother is 12 years younger than I am, and I vividly remember him as great fun at age 5. At the dinner table he'd just talk. And talk. And talk some more. About everything. And most of it was really funny. He was also very energetic and enthusiastic about everything, always up for a hike or a trip to the store or to go with me to walk the dog.

I left for college when he was 6, but that year that he was in Kg and I was in 12th grade was a kick.

[clkl]

Hello Laura,

Short answer: Yes. Something magical happens at around four years old.

Longer answer:
I'm a mother of five, with the youngest just over three years old right now. With my "data-set", three and a half is the hardest stretch of the toddler-through-preschool stage.

I have always enjoyed the "Txxxxxx Twos", cheering their emerging independence and personality. By the time we come along to 3.5, however, the gleeful "NO" of the 2 year old just seems like whiny negativity.

Around four years old, the grumpy knee-jerk complaining and rejecting clouds dissipate, and there is a sunrise of competence. Everyone feels better.

If you don't have them already, the Gessel Institute books (Your One Year Old, Your Two Year Old, Your Three Year Old, etc.) are very helpful.

Good luck! There's much to enjoy at this stage, and (begin the truest cliché) it goes so fast! (end the truest cliché)

All the best,
CLKL

[Christi]

Seconded. Although I think Moxie's posted before about developmental rough spots that can occur at the half-year and year points. But once that passes, four is much much better.

[Jody]

Oh, I don't know. Are there siblings in the mix? If there are no siblings, then I would bet that four and five will be huge improvements -- although there's still plenty of push-pull "I love you, I hate you" going on, especially once you throw kindergarten into the mix and everyone is stressed and anxious, if only for a few weeks, or the months leading up to it.

Honestly, I know in my head that three was a hard age (I loved 18-36 months myself) but every age has had its challenges for me, and once I get over the excitement of "THAT isn't a problem anymore," I'm usually pretty exhausted by whatever each age's challenges are.

That having been said, if you can get your morning routine off-loaded to the kids (YOU make the bed, dress yourself, brush your teeth, and bring me the comb), there's something so lovely about that, and for us, it started right around four-and-a-half.

I don't know. This is a tough question for me to answer in retrospect. But maybe it's just because THREE of any age are tough? I have to say, the fighting lately just wears me to a thread.

[Maria]

My daughter is just over 3 and a half now, and about 4 weeks ago made such a sudden and wonderful shift – so many things that were a huge struggle for 6 months or MORE are just not anymore: brushing teeth, going for walks, going to sleep, getting dressed… so many of those daily battles of wills have turned into just another thing we do everyday so that we can get to the fun stuff.

This is not to say that everything is easy breezy now, and I certainly don't expect it to continue moving forward with no bumps in the road, but it does feel like I got to a light at the end of a long, frustrating 3 year old tunnel, so take heart!

[Frustrated]

OK, this post rings true with me because it sums up nicely the six-eight questions I was going to send moxie this week.

My inability to cope with my almost four-year-old is just driving me crazy. I expected three to be tough, but after ten months of it, I'm going out of my gourd. He craves control...if I give him some, he abuses it...so he gets a timeout and we both end up mad and crying.

I've tried conversations like, "You can choose to listen or choose to miss ____" but that doesn't work. My recent tack involves talking about consequences and he tells me that "those are your consequences, not mine".

To add fuel to the fire, I'm pregnant and spend so much time wondering what the hell we were thinking. My confidence is shot and I am just not seeing the light at the end of the tunnel.

My SIL tells me that on the 4th birthday he'll magically turn into a prince. I hope so.

[Jo-Ann]

Thank you so much fror posting this. I have a boy who will be 4 in late September and he is going through something very similar.

My husband and I have been really depressed about his opposional behavior.

thanks!!!!!!!!! we are not alone!!!

[Alice]

Take heart. It can be as if a switch was flipped (but more likely you will one day suddenly realize that you are no longer fighting the way you were). I am right in the midst of this, with two girls who are 4 1/2 months apart, so right now 4.1 and 3.9. 4.1 is sooo much easier than just a few months ago. Not that everything is perfect but the extremes are mellowing. I do feel like there was a particularly difficult stretch just before it changed, as if the tantrums were being tested once more before giving them up. So maybe your frustration is about a developmental shift that is about to occur. For your sake, I hope so.

[Amy]

So far in my house "Kindergarten" has been the magic age. My son was unbearable until he started Kindergarten and then this miraculous transformation came over him. I'm hoping my theory is true as my "very difficult" 4, almost 5, yr old daughter starts Kindergarten in the fall and I'm not sure we'll all survive one more minute of her wretchedness beyond the first week of school.

Why Kindergarten? Well, I think there's something empowering to them about being in "school". Perhaps the expectations are moved up a notch... they are treated in a certain way... more personal responsibility? I'm sure others could come up with more reasons. Seriously, my son was night and day...

I know this doesn't help the mother of a 3 yr old... but in my home, 4 yrs old was even worse than 3, but 5 and on has been pure heaven. Good luck.

[hedra]

there's a brain transition (from emotional to logical) around age 3-3.5, if I recall correctly. It messes with their function for a while, and then, the other side seems to 'come on line' and ta-DA! Wonder child! Curiousity abounds, anxiety reduces, they're wonders. They learn rules easily (compared to earlier), they have apparent internal structure and discipline, it is fun and interesting.

Around age 7, they flip back again, and lose all those nice structures, forget everything, start being snotty again (oh, the groaning and eye rolling and back-talk and foot dragging!), but it is normal, and if you walk them back through the rules (or drag them through), they learn it again, and at around 8-8.5 they start clicking along again. (Fortunately I had a teacher-friend who warned me about 'the dreaded loss of structure at 7' - kids suddenly couldn't remember to put their pencils away even if they'd done it every day for the previous three years...).

So, yes, have loved 4 in general, and 5 not so bad either, six is entertaining, seven ... not looking forward to seven... but then back again before 9. We're at 9 now, so we'll see what swings where next. I just keep telling myself it isn't their fault, it is their age (heck, I tell THEM that about each other, too - your brother will not be a pest like that forever, he's just X age right now).

[Kateri]

I heard this too, and when my daughter turned four, I kept waiting until the Magic happened. And it finally has, she is now 4.5 and in the past month it seems like something changed over and all of her babyness is gone. She is fully a child now. I like it. I can already tell that the next few years might be my favortie time of parenthoood. Her thoughts suddenly became so insightful and interesting.

[Rachel]

Laura, you are not alone! When my son turned two I wondered what all the fuss about the terrible two's was about. He was never terrible. And then 3 hit and he became quite the challenge! I have to say that about 3.5 he started to even out and then became quite delightful again around 4. Now at 5 he is a joy to be around. He is funny, helpful, kind and full of information! Obviously he has his off days but for the most part we have really happy days. This is especially encouraging for me because I also have a 3 year old daughter who is kicking our butts! There are many days that it is a fight from the minute she gets up (I want Cheerios and then when you give them to her she cries b/c she really wanted Shreddies...) until she goes to bed. I have to constantly remind myself that it will get better.

I think a lot of it has to do with the fact that at 3 they have more advanced cognitive and reasoning processes and that they are becoming more independent. At the same time, they still have some physical and verbal limitations (particularly obvious when they have an older role model they seek to copy) and tend to flip flop between their desire to be independant and a need to still be dependant (ie. the struggle between "I'm a big girl" and "I'm just little") and cared for. I can see a lot of frustration in my daughter. I know that once she passes a few more milestones that life will get a lot easier for all of us.

It will get better soon and then before you know it, you will forget how bad it felt at the time and just enjoy when your child is at.

[Joy]

To Frustrated: I have a four year old and just had another baby in November. The four year old has gone through quite a bit of 'i need attention' stuff, beginning even before her sister was born. (She is also the middle child, and exhibiting classic middle- child symptoms.), but on the flip side, she just adores her little sister. She loves being the 'big girl' now and that she's able to help with the baby. I think it helps her to feel she's needed and important. She still has an occasional meltdown, but usually only when she's overtired and needs to rest. I think it having an older sibling helps deflect a little toddler angst- at least it's not always directed at you.

I'm constantly having to remind myself to focus on the positive, count my blessings, and not give any creedence to a toddler's angry 'I HATE YOU!!!'s. I think the best response to that is, 'That's okay that your angry and feel that way now, but I Love You anyway.' Another good excercise is to sit down at night when the epic battle that is bedtime is over and everyone's asleep and try to remember a few moments that day that were precious and sweet. It helps to go to sleep with a mind filled with positive thoughts, and reduces the dread of waking up to more battles the next day. It's difficult now, but someday you'll catch them playing together and just having the best time that only siblings can have together... and it'll all be worth it.

[Kted]

This is my first encounter with this site, and I'm quite amazed at all the posts about how much 'trouble' people are having with their babies and toddlers. Everyone wants to know how to get them to sleep, eat, etc.,(particularly sleep) but completely reject all advice books other than those with a purely 'follow-the-child, attachment parenting, focus to them. I have nothing against attachment parenting, but I think when you take the approach that the child knows best and follow your (your child's really?) instincts, then you should probably be the type that really doesn't mind when your baby is up 3 or 4 times during the night still at 12 months. Which is basically what advice-givers such as Sears are saying - that it's normal and to be expected and it's perfectly OK that you won't get a full night's sleep for years. I understand how that can work for some people and be unfathomable for others but it's striking to me how no one here seems to see the coorelation between the laissez-faire parenting approach and all the 'issues' these parents are having. It's not an issue if that's the way you've chosen to have things, is it?

[Rudyinparis]

Huh. Odd how people walk away from things with different perceptions, Kted. I've always thought this site was quite varied in the parenting approaches discussed. I would say most people here (myself included) don't desire to use hardcore Ferber methods or let a baby cry for an extended amount of time, but apart from that, there are so many different methods here, and this is such an accepting community--to me, always a refuge from dogmatic parenting sites. I definitely disagree that this community follows a doctrine that "child knows best" in the way you suggest.

[Rudyinparis]

Huh. Odd how people walk away from things with different perceptions, Kted. I've always thought this site was quite varied in the parenting approaches discussed. I would say most people here (myself included) don't desire to use hardcore Ferber methods or let a baby cry for an extended amount of time, but apart from that, there are so many different methods here, and this is such an accepting community--to me, always a refuge from dogmatic parenting sites.

[Amy]

Hedra, thank you for that info about 7-8 yrs. I keep thinking WTF with my daughter...she was so "past" this stuff already! Just as my son got easier at 4, she got difficult at 8!! Phew! I'm not delirious, it is actually happening.

[Amy]

oh, and it may (or may not... depends on your level of optimism) help to realize that EVERYTHING happens in cycles IMO. When I realize I'm butting heads with my kids, I just tell myself "We're coming around to the Other Side of this cycle, and in a few months we'll be back to the fun/easy/good side". It helps. For the most part. Ying/yang and all that.

[holly]

Kted,

First, AP is not "laissez-faire." Read more about it.

Secondly, the parents who write in to this site, do so seeking advice, support, and other viewpoints on very COMMON parenting issues. Implying that their challenges are ALL their own making is counterproductive and incorrect. People write in here because they care and want the best for their families. Period.

Lastly, I do think that there are a variety of parenting styles and approaches represented on this site. I find most of the advice here to be child-focused, and maybe that is what is throwing you off. "Child-focused" is not just letting the child do whatever they want - it is understanding where the child is functioning in his cognitive/emotional/physical development and having expectations and guidence techniques which are appropriate, and ultimately, the most productive at that stage.

I have found this site, Moxie's info, and the posts of her readers so helpful over the past year and a half. I hope that it can also open up some other viewpoints and useful information for you and your family.

[Julie]

I think the parents who visit this site regularly have strong feelings about the diversity of parenting styles among the group. I know I do. I would not consider myself an "attachment parenting" parent - yet I come to this site every day seeking advice and new knowledge among a group of people who are going through the same things I am. I never co-slept with my son, and I had him on a fairly regimented schedule from very early on...because that is MY style of parenting. And I feel VERY welcomed on this site, I feel my viewpoint is accepted and respected, I feel that there are many other posters who are similar to me in parenting style, and I am interested to read about other approaches to problems that are common among parents of young children. In addition to reading this post I have read every book (or so it feels ) from Ferber to Weissbluth to Ezzo and back again - AND GOT A LOT OUT OF THEM!!!. It's dangerous to assume people here have not read any (or rejected) books other than those by Sears and other attachment parenting authors. After all that reading......I have found the magic answers are not necessarily in books, but in watching and listening to my child - which is what Moxie and friends advocate and advise. That is NOT "attachment parenting" but ATTENTIVE PARENTING.

IMO, all parents face challenges and have trouble getting their children to sleep. (Sleep is the NUMBER ONE topic for moms!!! It makes sense that this is a common topic of conversation on this post!) I find the parents who have the MOST trouble are not those of a particular label, but those who are trying to parent in a style that is not natural for them. I know many attachment parents who started out thinking they should be more regimented and were extremely uncomfortable and unhappy. I know if I had adhered to an "attachment parenting" style I would have been equally challenged and uncomfortable. Most parents find a blend between the two. And ALL parents, regardless of their style, encounter problems.

I have found there are two general "types" of moms (or parents/caregivers) - the ones who listen to a parenting challenge, commiserate and offer helpful suggestions, and the ones who tell you how THEIR way is the BEST way and that if everyone did it that way their problems would be solved. It takes great finesse and tact to walk the line between talking and telling, and I have to say Moxie and the contributors to this website do so beautifully EVERY DAY. I urge Kted to do a little more reading and to focus on the questions being asked as well as the comments. It's not about complaining about "issues" with our children, it's an open conversation about the challenges of being the best parent you can be. I don't call that complaining, I call it communicating. It's healthy to talk about the challenges and frustrations parents face. I think anyone who thinks parenting isn't filled with challenges and frustrations is not "present" in their parenting.

And I'm sorry this topic has taken the attention away from Laura's question. And since I don't yet have a 3 year old, I am saving the comments from this post and the previous posts about 3 year olds for future reference, when I find myself in their shoes. Because regardless of whether I was an attachment parent, a regimented one or somewhere in the middle, the chemistry of the brain and developmental stages of children (and the behaviors and challenges that accompany these stages) are not controlled by which "style" of parent you are.

[susan]

Our son is only 1 year and I feel like I get close the blowing point with him on occasion (whining, hitting, throwing everything, etc etc). I'm happy to hear everyone's comiserations (I love this blog) and it's good to know what's on the distant horizon (forewarned is forearmed) but IT'S SCARING THE HECK OUT OF ME!

SO ... does anyone have advice of how we might 'nip things in the bud' now so that our 3-4th year is better? hahaha i'm sure there's no magic solution/pill but maybe there are things you'd have done differently along the way in hindsight???? if so, P....L.....E.....A.......S......E share now!

[kted]

Apologies if I offended anyone with my previous post. I was responding to the passage in quotes below, which was posted by Moxie last August.

" I despise Babywise, and there are huge numbers of people who have been hurt (and their relationships with their children hurt) by Ezzo. For the full critique on what's wrong with the Babywise approach, you can check out http://ezzo.info

Basically, any book that tells you to fight biology by never allowing a child to go to sleep by feeding (among other things) is completely full of it and is making tons of extra work for the parents (and let's be real, it's the mothers who usually have this extra work, rarely the fathers). Nature already built in this wonderful way to get your baby to sleep, and if you mess with it by imposing some ridiculous schedule about the baby always having to "play" after feeding or only eating at specified times then you are messing around with the way babies are hardwired. Of course people who "do Babywise" have these calm, placid babies, because the babies' spirits have been broken. They've been taught to ignore their own hunger cues and other needs, and just to wait passively until the parents decide it's time for the next thing to happen.

I think there are some religious communities that value "breaking" children. If you don't belong to one of these communities, then Babywise is something you want to stay far away from.

Books I don't recommend:
Babywise and all of it's siblings. Ezzo has no child development experience, early editions of the book cause Failure to Thrive in many babies, and the alleged Biblical basis of the ideas in the book are misinterpretations at best and deliberate blasphemy at worst. http://ezzo.info
Anything by the Pearls. No. Just no. Although I doubt anyone inclined to follow the Pearls is reading me anyway.
The Baby Whisperer. Hogg's not a malevolent nutjob like Ezzo, and she does have some good tips on certain topics, but the idea that all kids have to follow the same sequence of events every day? Not sound. Also, if your child doesn't go down to sleep from being awake by 4 months, nothing bad will happen to anyone. This book will make you feel inadequate and make a ton of extra work for you. If you're going to read it, borrow it from the library or a friend instead of spending good money, and keep your common sense with you as you read."

That post didn't seem too 'varied in the parenting approaches' to me. I didn't mean to imply that AP or child-centered parenting is wrong, or that I don't actually use some of that advice myself. Of course, I could just leave a site that I don't agree with without posting my opinion. But it pained me to read some of the advice people are giving to parents who have 1 year olds that have never slept through the night. My advice would be an adamant - 'There is a solution to this!' I really feel for the parents who go a year (or more!) without a full night's sleep but I guess there are some parents who really don't mind up to 12 months but then start thinking maybe they'd like to sleep eventually. For me, that happened by 6 months,but I definitely understand the feeling. And IMO, some babies also need uninterrupted nighttime sleep, so not having helped them to sleep through the night might not be helping the babies either in the long term. Not to mention the downside of constantly sleep-deprived parents. But obviously that is ONLY my opinion. I'm sure there are babies out there who thrive despite frequent night wakings, but I know my child falls apart when he doesn't get enough sleep.

And FYI: I've never read Babywise, but the Baby Whiperer pretty much saved my life when I was at the end of my rope as a clueless new parent with a reflux and collicky baby, and I kind of feel the (misplaced?) duty to defend her honor. And there is nothing of a 'broken spirit' in my baby. If anything, the baby whisperer helps first time parents to better understand, accept and work with their baby's natural temperment, not control them.

[Carla Hinkle]

I hear your pain, as I also have a 3+ year old. I also wonder if some of it has to do with outgrowing naps -- my daughter sometimes skips one and then is EXTRA miserable. But sometimes has one and then wants to stay up til 10 pm and party. Either way, I notice the cranky, I'm-the-boss-of-you attitude increases signifcantly after about 4 pm ...

[Carla Hinkle]

Kted -- I guess I would say that Moxie herself seems to be a particular kind of parent -- AP-ish, sort of on the crunchy side. She tries to be respectful of different methods but, as everyone does, she has opinions on things (and it is her website, after all). There are a variety of parenting philosophies that come through in the comments but as might be expected, lots of people who post here agree with Moxie (only logical that people who stick with a community would find common ground).

In any event, I think the post in question was directed at someone asking what books would be good for a new parent to read, and Moxie giving her opinion. I do have to agree with you that I think the Baby Whisperer didn't get a totally fair shake here. I never once let my baby cry, and didn't consider myself particularly regimented, but I LOVED the Baby Whisperer as a new mom.

[Shelley]

Susan, right now it sounds like your kid is frustrated because he can't communicate what he wants -- this gets better as their spoken language gets better. IME the more you can do to provide your kid with choices, even simple ones, and situations in which he feels competent the happier everyone is.

Kted, there are a lot of different viewpoints here. Really. As I'm sure Moxie would agree, sometimes the commenters come with the best stuff of all. I don't think the people posting questions here have more issues than the average parent, or that the issues are necessarily caused by the parents' parenting style. This is an advice website, after all, and people only write when there's something that's not working for them right now.

[Shandra]

Susan, I just wanted to share my own particular approach with the under-3-or-so crowd, but it's not like I can prove it works yet (or ever could, since each child is different).

But one thing I have found makes me a much better parent right now (21 mo old) is not to worry so much about whether he'll be spoiled at 8, whiny a 6, into drugs at 14. Yes these are totally my concerns but he is just a baby! I don't remember bein 21 months old and although I think a lot of my trust or lack thereof in the world and sense of things developed at that time... I don't think any bad habits from then are still with me. I don't still ride in a car seat, or climb down stairs on my bum.

I don't think you can, with tiny babes, "nip things in the bud." Because the "things" are going to change so much. What I think I can do is show them how your family works. For me right now this means "what I say is trustworthy" - if I say no, I will get up and move you right away. If I ay we are going swimming, we are. If you are sad you will be comforted.

The rest I figure changes anyway. I personally find thi has reduced my stress and made me a much more responsive parent.

[Kay]

4 is worse than 3. It's 3 with cognitive malice. Come on September - and 5.

[Slim]

I wanted to hush Kay, but I know she's not the only one who's had that experience.

For me, though, three (all the willfulness of a two year old, plus enough memory to be undistractible and to bring up past injustices) and six (first-grader 'tude by the bucket) have been the worst.

A friend who's had a very challenging with her son said four was the first time life was sometimes easy.

[lydia]

Parenting books are like diet books. All of the plans work for SOMEBODY. Still, it's really rare that people can live according to any "plan" all the time.

My kids are two and two months, so I don't know much yet about four. But my sister in law says that when her youngest turned four is when she started getting her "own life" back. My mother, however, says that two AND four are the hard years and three's actually a kind of break. I guess it depends on the kid, as we've said again and again on this site.

As for Attachment Parenting, I guess I agree with much of the philosophy, but I'm not very good at either breastfeeding or babywearing. My kids thrive anyway. I think any kind of parenting that goes by a "label" is going to be limiting.

[hedra]

kted, I'll admit that I tend to get wary myself when anyone does a list of books - there's always one I like on the 'other' list, LOL! I think you jumped to a conclusion based on that, a bit. I'm chuckling a bit at the 'attachment parenting = sleep issues' drift of your post, though. My best friend used Ezzo, which is a strict baby-training method, and her main issue? Sleep. Durn kids wouldn't stay trained.

I do hope you stick around and read a bit more. You're not at all the only fan of the Baby Whisperer here. I'm not a fan, but then, I'm not a fan of most parenting books, Sears included. Much more a fan of developmental books (What's Going On In There? and The Wonder Weeks), which teach you what's normal for the age, and then leave you alone to make up your own mind how to proceed. And I'm a fan of this site, because it is SO oriented toward the commonality of experience - kids have sleep regressions no matter what sleep approach you use. Kids have autonomy issues at 2, no matter what you did when they were 1. Kids brains transition growth from one side to the other reliably and regularly no matter how you raise them. We're all here to share on the matter. And often enough, sharing is how I figure out what I need to do next, myself.

Which brings me to Susan's question of what would help with the tough transitions ahead...

1) Learn to collaborate on solutions. No, my 2-year-old twins aren't really good at understanding what I mean when I say 'we have a problem. you want to walk THAT direction. I want to walk THIS direction. How can we solve this together?'... but if I repeat it simply a few times, it starts to sink in, and hopefully at 3.5, the intense frustration and volatility my other kids have had will be eased somewhat by knowing that we have a history of working it out together, and that I'm here to help. really.

2) (variation of item 1) Practice saying yes. Since two is a year of great dreams being thwarted (I'm sure my kids knew they could fly, but it was just mommy thwarting their leaping off of things that kept it from becoming true...), they start 3 being aware that you are NOT ON THEIR TEAM (hence the dawning of that sneaky look, if it hasn't shown up before now). When they hit that transition point, they're alone, they can't count on you, and they already know you will stop them from doing things they want to do. Mommy is all about NO, STOP, SLOW DOWN, DON'T TOUCH, etc. - even when we couch it in terms of 'yes' or other words, they know they're being thwarted. Learn to pick your battles before you open your mouth, and say yes regularly. This is one of those places for Safe/Respectful/Kind to come in - filter for what is important, and say yes to the rest. Plus you can find ways to make a no into a Yes - 'let's run down the hill together, holding hands - that's safe enough for me, and still fun!'

3) Watch for signs of pre-meltdown 'phase changes' or warning signs, and learn them. My second child would start getting slightly glassy-eyed before a meltdown/crisis would occur. He'd also become more physically rigid, and would have a harder time looking up from an activity he was engaged in if I tried to get his attention. These were all signs that he was locking up or running on empty in some way - sleep, food, patience, resources of some sort.

One of the twins becomes rigid (body), the other tends to tighten up her face (especially around her mouth). Useful info. Learning to spot the 'pre-freak-out' signs was as important (okay, MORE important in some ways) as learning the pre-crying hunger cues when they were babies. There ARE signs. Learn them. And when you spot them, do something. Get down at their level, hand them a snack, decide it is actually time to go home now (instead of after the freakout occurs), teach them words or signs for 'feeling overwhelmed' or whatever else seems to trigger them. If you catch them before they transition into the 'uh-oh' zone, you have a chance to teach them how to manage themselves while they're still mostly-sorta in control, and you can help them with the process as you go. It makes SOOOOOOooooooo much difference being able to catch it before the crisis erupts fully.

Those are my main ideas. And thanks for the reminder - I was just talking to my DH at lunch, and was floundering around for a way to stop one twin from pestering the other... I suspect the pre-meltdown signs would be a big help (I only just figured them out last weekend, but hadn't gotten to the 'how to use this info' point yet). So, there, your question helped ME. :)

[STL Mom]

My daughter was one of the kids who suddenly changed from a horrible toddler to a sweet little girl, right about the time she turned three, and about the time her little brother was born. She still had bad moments (and days) but generally you could reason with her, explain things to her, and make deals with her.
My son just turned four, and sometimes I think he is reverting back to a two-year-old. He is gradually making progress, but it is slow and hard sometimes. But it is still far better than two!
I guess in my opinion you can't predict when and how an individual child will develop. How hard a certain age is has a lot to do with the kid's personality and your personality, and which behaviors you find particularly irritating. For me the biggest milestones were getting the kids sleeping through the night in their own rooms, and not having to carry them all the time. When your kid is yelling and crying but continues to walk toward the car on his own two feet, that's a banner day!

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